Deandre Ayton‘s future in Phoenix is an open question after the disastrous end to the Suns‘ season Sunday night, and ESPN’s Adrian Wojnarowski said plenty of teams are planning to target the young center in free agency (video link).
Ayton played just 17 minutes in the Game 7 loss to Dallas. He remained on the bench after being pulled early in the third quarter and had a heated exchange with coach Monty Williams that had to be broken up by assistant coaches. Ayton didn’t talk to the media after the game to answer questions about the incident.
According to Wojnarowski, Ayton has felt unappreciated since last offseason, when Phoenix decided against giving him a rookie-scale extension. He will be a restricted free agent this summer when the Suns extend a $16.4MM qualifying offer.
“Deandre Ayton did not feel valued by this Phoenix organization,” Wojnarowski said. “They were not able to come to an agreement on his rookie extension. He saw many of the top players in his class get extensions and he wanted a max deal, he would not move off that. So now he moves towards restricted free agency this summer where he’ll have some more options.”
The top pick in the 2018 draft, Ayton remains extremely valuable as a 23-year-old center who averaged 17.2 points and 10.2 rebounds this season while shooting a career-best 63.4% from the field. Wojnarowski doesn’t expect the Suns to let him leave with nothing in return, but suggests that they could be open to a sign-and-trade deal.
“Ultimately, Phoenix can still match an offer out there and keep him if he signs an offer sheet with another team,” Wojnarowski added. “… [He] is going to get a max contract in the marketplace, somewhere… There are a lot of teams lining up to figure out: how can we acquire him?”
The Suns already have nine players under contract for next season at a total salary of $128.3MM, which is above the projected cap of $122MM. They are less than $20MM below the projected luxury tax threshold of $149MM, so retaining Ayton and avoiding the tax would require some additional moves.
The Pistons are consider the betting favorites to land Ayton if he doesn’t return to Phoenix, tweets Rod Beard of The Detroit News, citing odds from BetOnline.ag. The online gambling site has Detroit at even odds, the Magic at 2-to-1, Spurs at 3-1, Pacers at 4-1, Trail Blazers at 6-1, Thunder at 8-1, Rockets at 10-1, and Bulls at 12-1.
– “They were not able to come to an agreement on his rookie extension.”
Yes, because he and his agents refused to sit down with the FO until they agreed (in advance) to give him a 5 year max deal. How many of his classmates made that demand and had their teams capitulate to it?
The ones that deserve it, like him.
Name them, and reference the source.
Luca Doncic
Trae Young
Michael Porter Jr
SGA
all received 5 year deals from his draft class.
Sadly, Ayton is the only one that had to demand to be treated like the franchise cornerstone he is.
You look at win shares per 48 from the 2018 draft Ayton ranks 3rd ahead of everyone who received a 5 year deal. He ranks 4th in actual win share with only Doncic, Young, and Mitchell Robinson ahead of him.
So, no other classmate did that.
I guess you think Mitch is entitled to a 5 year max as well (since WS’s are dispositive). Mitch must be a fool to be discussing his next contract with NYK FO, vs saying he won’t talk to them until they agree with him.
No other classmate been shown the disrespect Ayton has, which led to his actions. You seem to completely disregard his production and seem to only care about his action of demanding a 5 year contract.
Do you have an actual rebuttal as to why Ayton doesn’t deserve a 5 year max contract?
Cause so far you just seem to be whining about him expecting to be treated with respect and given the contract he deserves with production to back up his demands.
Disrespect? Don’t be a silly little boy. Nobody was disrespected. This is a business disagreement, garden variety actually. Ayton is young, and while he needs to own his actions (including those made on his behalf), I’m actually less critical of him here than his agents, who almost certainly mis-characterized the matter to him to stroke his ego and/or mask their own ineptitude.
Rebuttal to what? You, like his agents, didn’t make any case. Ayton only deserves an audience, and was offered one. He passed. Now, even if he gets a max offer sheet, he’ll get a lesser contract than PHX was almost certainly going to offer him. Good news is his agents’ percentage will be less as well.
I don’t necessarilt agree with Oh boy but he does mention 4 classmates, doncic, young, sga and porter jr that got max extensions.
Yes, he mentioned the 4 classmates, but didn’t suggest that any of them refused to sit down with their team to discuss the extension. DEN is the only team I know negotiated qualifiers to the 5 years for injury, but that’s not the point.
Other teams let the news that’s what they were going to do leak out. The Cavs already let Garland’s extention leak out.
If you want to argue win shares by that logic Mitchell Robinson deserves a max too.
@Dxc
The NBA is the easiest league for an agent to operate. The numbers are predetermined. “I WANT A 5 YEAR MAX DEAL” = The most money allowed x 5 years. What’s there to discuss other than bells, whistles, travel perks, ticket allotment, type of rooms on the road, trade kickers, no trade clauses and maybe language regarding weight/ health standards (if allowed under cba).
So that’s it. The hosts here can probably state what the max contract numbers are but what’s there to negotiate in terms of years/ money? If the Sun’s don’t agree to that number then there’s nothing to discuss.
Sorry, that approach (I won’t negotiate unless I know I’m getting my way up front) is complete amateur hour. It would be laughable in any real business environment. Maybe his agents aren’t bright enough to make the case that he deserves what he wants, or elicit and understand PHX’s position and what they might offer instead. A real representative/ negotiator NEVER passes on a chance to do either.
Considering teams can cut you and not have to pay you the entirety of the contract you both agreed to and signed, it makes sense to only agree to contracts you’re happy with.
Phoenix was able to dish out 133 million to role players. Couldnt find time or money to pay Ayton what he is worth. Suns broke off contract negotiations and gave him the finger by paying others. And people wonder why he feels disrespected.
link to news.yahoo.com
Having a good bench is important. You act as if there isn’t important context to why people don’t want to give him the max. Luka, MPJ, and Young are all scoring wings or guards in a league where that is how you win. The threshold to be a max center right now is essentially Embiid or Jokic. The Suns also have CP3, Booker, and Bridges and can do well enough with a cheaper center.
I agree he should feel disrespected. Imo money became an issue in Phoenix. Cause when they became a contender. Now players had to get paid.
Bigs are not as valued today. That’s a big mistake to me. If Porter can get a max deal. Ayton should have no problem getting one. But it’s not the case. In the end I think he will get his contract. Suns are not getting the most out of his talent. They would have no problem moving him in a sign n trade. So he will get his. It’s just business imo.
@Dxc
Absolutely incorrect. Im a music agent. I’ve reached out to an artist regarding a tour run and they told me, we’re not accepting any offers for review less than $200k all-inclusive but we may require local ground. Cool. I reached out to buyers and informed them of the ask. “Oh, can I offer $175k. Can you at least bring it to them? I replied “No”. Why because I was already told the minimum.
Everyone knows what the 5 year max numbers are. That’s what they want and the ONLY thing to negotiate are some of the terms and clauses and the bells and whistles. But that money has to be 5 years at that predetermined max numbers. That’s the point. It’s already predetermined what that ACTUAL amount is. So what’s there to discuss?
@KnicksFanCavsFan –
I’m a professional representative as well, many years. Your fact patten is not comparable to Ayton’s situation. Putting out a minimum price to multiple bidders or prospective buyers is not a dispute between contract parties. Your situation is no different than a retailer putting a price tag on an item for sale. In both scenarios, nobody is looking to anyone specifically to be a buyer. If the market fails at that price point, the price will likely be lowered.
Ayton was already under contract to PHX, and he wanted an extension and that could come only from PHX. He wanted certain terms, that he could never get from any other team. PHX wanted to extend him too, and offered to meet, but wouldn’t agree up front on 5 years (note – even at 4 years, they could make an offer that’s better than any offer sheet he might get the following year). These parties either do an extension with each other now, or it rolls over to next year and Ayton is, financially, a loser, not to mention he bears the injury risk for a year.
OK, let’s say you’re the Agent here. Ayton is your client. How would you advise him. Tell him to refuse to sit down with the team unless they agree in advance to the 5 year max?
I’m really confused why you are blaming Ayton and not the Suns. Suns had 3-4 yrs to understand, develop, build trust with Ayton. Suns failed their #1 draft pick miserably. It’s almost like they didnt want him to produce or lead like a max player. :(
@Dxc
There’s nothing to sit down and discuss. He wants a 5 year max. Imo, it likely isn’t PURELY about the numbers. It’s more likely, LITERALLY, what the 5 year max says to a player. It says, “we value you”, “you mean something to us”. They showed Booker the love. They gave a late 30’s Paul a 4 year max that takes him to 40. Ayton may feel that the style the team plays mutes his talent a bit. While others have flourished under Paul. Mikhail Bridges has gotten paid, not a max but at the turn of $22.5 per. He may feel that on a team that features him more that he can put up those bigger numbers that could net a max deal and that if he is going to put the team first they could at least pony up the money knowing he’s sacrificing his game. Yes, big men are valued differently today, but a FG% of 64% might warrant him putting up more than 10 shots a game. He could easily be a 25/10+ guy if he took as many shots as Booker who puts up 20+ shots per game. Ayton might feel like if the Suns won’t give him the max then he can get a max from other teams albeit the total years and dollars will likely be less. But how much less? The max from the Sun’s would be 5/$177. The max from any other team would be 4/$131. That’s $35 × 5 vs $32 ×4. If the Sun’s come with less than the max then it’s likely that the aapy would be LESS than an outside team. He gets 1 year less but he might bank on himself and be willing to give the Suns the middle finger if he feels like someone wants him more and are willing to feature him more.
Demanding the final number up front is an overreach by the agent. It was a hardball power play that has failed so far, and should fail.
Not all #1 picks get maxxes Michol. And all players are expected to produce at whatever their contract level is. Points that start with blaming for blame is a rhetorical device for softer heads. It’s about the agent and the process anyway.
I’m Not sure Woj is right anyway. Ayton’s team was more than double down, and I did not see him featured despite the guards getting destroyed.
Ayton can make up reasons for being mad that is better for his cause than just saying I want the ball more, even if that is the case.
Bear in mind he is getting advice from agents who have already started this course of action years ago and now are motivated to get Ayton to continue and finish their strategy.
It saves agents from having to face negotiators, as if they’re job is not easy enough already. They can stay in their coccoon with their win shares talk.
It was basically Suns choice to use Ayton as #3, #4 option not only on court, but also leadership and responsibilty as well. Bottom line is Suns failed to develop him and/or they dont believe in his future. It’s LOSE LOSE situation for Suns. Ayton will get his payday and it’s time for him to go elsewhere where his stats will skyrocket.
Agreed.
Bottom line here: professional norms aside, if Ayton had played to the level of Luka or Trae there would have been no doubt on his value, even in a Sarver run organization.
But when you belong to that next tier, w/ MPJ and SGA, the max becomes a more tenuous proposition.
I’m sure Denver, in hindsight, would have preferred to kick the can a year on MPJ.
@KnicksFanCavsFan –
So, is your answer to my last question is that you, as his agent, would advise Ayton to refuse to sit down and discuss the extension unless PHX agreed up front to the 5 years?
@Dxc
Agents want to get the most money possible. I would NOT sit down with the Sun’s and negotiate down from a 5 year max. I’d tell them to submit their current offer, back channel and collect 4 year max offers from other perspectives, compare the offers and if Ayton wants to stay with the Suns longterm then I’d go to the table. However, once I agree to sit at that table then likely there’s no chance at the 5 year max. Ayton might want the respect of a 5 year and if he feels insulted then we walk. The tail doesn’t wag the dog.
Ayton needs to be paired with a great point guard to maximize his skill set, which the Suns have. If they don’t max him they could target someone like Mitch Robinson to replace him, but he’s a pretty significant downgrade. Any team with cap space or the ability to create enough will want him, so the Suns better act quick to smooth over whatever rifts exist between him and the organization. Ayton will probably look for an opt-out after the first year in whatever deal he signs to maintain his leverage.
No one will sign him to a long term max with an opt out after the first year. Not even sure that’s legal under the CBA (pretty sure it isn’t). The NBA has an alternative though: It’s called forcing your way out of town.
I would love to see him in Toronto, maybe GT Jr as the centerpiece.
If the Stones don’t get the #1 pick tonight, I think they go after him. With the Suns being exposed by the Mavs for being a slow/plotting team, I think they might have an interest in swapping Ayton for JG. That said, Detroit could trade JG somewhere else for draft picks/other stuff and sign Ayton outright.
Based on their current cap space, they wouldn’t need to clear that much space to sign him to an offer sheet. I believe they have the third-most cap space of any team this off-season.
He be great with Luka lol
Anyone would be fit great with Luka. Hell even I can knock down a wide open corner 3.
I think the Suns will ultimately make the right decision and let him leave. Yes he’s still young and good and all but planning ahead for the future is he a max player?
He gives me Tobias Harris vibes.
Good but not great. Not to mention without Chris Paul I sure Ayton wouldn’t be as good either and Paul is 36 or something and not far off retiring.
A sign and trade would be interesting.
What could they get in return for him?
What about Ayton for Wendell Carter Jr, Jalen Suggs and Terrance Ross?
Magic have heaps of point guards (Cole, Suggs, Fultz, RJ), Terrance Ross wants out on an expiring contract and Ayton would be a considerable upgrade over Carter. Magic still have a top pick in the draft aswell.
For the Suns, Suggs could be developed as the future after Chris Paul, Ross gives them some impact off the bench and Carter is a replacement for Ayton.
Another idea could be Ayton for Myles Turner and Buddy Heild.
Pacers build around Haliburton but getting a younger centre that will suit his game style. Two future all stars and the start of something special.
For the Suns they receive Turner as a replacement who brings a completely different skill set. Three point shooting and elite shot blocking. Plus they get Heild off the bench as a knock down three point shooter
Idk just some ideas, but I’m liking the Magic one
Too much money for Phx w Indy partnered
Magic deal doable
Id somehow like to see Cha jump into the fray but their monies to send out kinda sketchy and Im not sure Phx wants a do over w Oubre and PJ +scarps
Houstons interesting pending how they fall in draft w Wood+Gordon
OKC’s got the picks and a few party Favors
On paper
It seems that Suns want to cut payroll by talking to bad teams – cap space
Reality
Suns need to compete with top 5 teams by talking to Grizzlies and Warriors
Salary dump Saric separately
Yeah could send Heild off in another deal or third team… but thought the same thing.
Same with Charlotte they make sense but don’t have enough pieces that would interest the Suns. I can’t see the rockets having enough either with Wood on and doing deal.
As for OKC it would have to be for Shai or otherwise call declined and even that doesn’t make much sense.
Other teams and ideas could be,
Toronto with Siakim but can’t see that.
Knicks in a deal involving Randle but need serious extras to be added.
Maybe 3 team:
Suns: Randle and Turner
Knicks: Brogdan
Pacers: Ayton
CP3 Booker Bridges Randle Turner
Improve the defence, improve the floor spacing, Randle offers another 20 points per game scorer and another ball handler
Knicks get a point and Pacers get Ayton to build around Tyrese
The problem with moving DA this offseason is that – with the exception of maybe the Turner deal – most of the teams have future assets to offer.
Phoenix probably won’t be amenable to that, unless they’re moving CP as well and just going full nuclear here.
Most likely they’ll match a 4y max, see how Ayton develops, then once CP is out of town look to flip him at a discount if he doesn’t develop into what they’d like.
I love the Magic and Indy ideas. It depends if James Jones is forward thinking or still thinks they can win now. I would go with the Magic trade.
Yeah that Magic deal looks good to me.
Wendell Carter would be a lot better playing with CP3, Ross off the bench would be great for trying to win now and Suggs can run the second unit and learn from CP3.
Magic offload one of their point guards, to upgrade majorly at centre. Plus with this years pick they’d have a solid young team.
no way the magic give suggs and carter for him, no way
suggs #1/#2 of the PGs, no need for them to offload.
fultz and rj are second tier players
Suggs has not proven “first tier” yet, though it is possible, and risky to move him after one year.
There’s a lot of options with these trading partners in case plan A does not work out.
If Ayton has played for any 4 California team, they would give him 4-year max at $128 million
Harden is going to get 4-year $180 million
Harden getting $20-25mil per
Monty is a great coach, but he doesnt have guts to yell at CP3 or Booker. Same for Booker and CP3. They are all good good with each other, but constantly nag at Ayton during games. Ayton is no longer a rookie. He has paid his dues and doesnt deserve to be a scapegoat. Both Booker and CP3 had terrible game 7, and should have been called out during the game 7, whatever it took to get them to play better.
Well stated. Not a Suns fan but either that was the most gutless game 7 performance by stars like Booker and Paul, or there’s a lot going on in the locker room we just aren’t privy to
Not to take anything away from the Mavs and Luka as they played fantastic ball and simply showed they wanted it. As a fan of any sport, it’s not a wild exaggeration to say you just don’t see this kind of performance at the pro level
Your point about Monty is well taken but honestly, how many coaches are there these days who are not afraid to get in the ear of superstar, multi million dollar players? I’m speculating that going one step further, he failed to redirect this group from whatever was going on
He doesn’t worth max deal, at least not now. I remember articles in the past mentioned he doesn’t have the drive/work ethic to be a great player and that the team helped him with that (I’m guessing players and coaches) – so you can’t blame Phoenix for thinking twice before giving him a max.
Right now he’s a good player but not a max player, will he be a max player? Maybe, but imo he won’t, he’ll get the $$ and be “lazy”.
Ayton is a max all right!… I mean he is the best player in PHO!
He is a good player, but he isn’t a max player.
Ayton without Chris Paul in not a max player….CP3 spoon fed him…
Ayton in college avg 20.1 pts and 11.6 reb. If Chris would if fed him in Mavs series. Suns would still be playing. Suns don’t deserve Ayton. I hope he leaves.
I watched Ayton a lot before his draft. His offense was way ahead of his D. Yet he’s been a defensive force with Suns. This shows how unselfish he is. And how much he wants to be part of a team. I see him as next great center. A 2way force. Man …… I would love to have in NY. But I agree he needs a pass first PG. I’d give up Mitch this yrs #1, Grimes and a future #1. He’s just 23 yrs old.
I don’t agree he will turn into a great Center, that title its for players like Embiid or Jokic, the only great centers we have now. Ayton is not a max player, BUT he can get, and i think he will, get one max contract in the open market. That contract will be seen as a Tobaias situation, good not great like other said up here.
Hell, ill have Gobert over Ayton and still im not in love with Gobert’s contract.
Gobert’s contract is the price you pay for a multi time All Star/All-NBA/DPOY.
He fits their team. I think it’s a bit much. But who plays in Utah if you don’t pay him. He’s worth it to them. Defense is half the gm. Got that right.
23 yrs old. I guarantee he will. Just remember who told you.
2021-22 17.2 pts, 10.2 reb, 1.4 ast,
.634% FG (7.6-12), 29.5 mins a gm.
Embiid at 23 yrs old ……… 2017-18
22.9 pts, 11 reb, 3.2 ast,
.483% FG (8.1-16.8), 30.3 mins a gm
Jokic at 23 yrs old ……. 2018-19
20.1 pts, 10.8 reb, 7.3 ast
.511% FG (7.7-15.1), 31.3 mins
Both Jokic and Embiid are the #1 option at 23 yrs old. Ayton isn’t even option #3.
Yes I believe he is next great center. Cause I’ve watched him since college. His FG% is better than both of them. And he took 5 less shots a gm.
The next great center but yet you are only offering two firsts, an unsigned Mitch Robinson and Grimes?
Embiid was battling injuries those years, and the skillset doesn’t compare at all…
I get that he is not the 1st option, but he must show he has the ability to be 1st option, like Jokic and Embiid.
Their games are totally different
How can you trade and unsigned player. Mitch and Grimes are worth two #1 picks or more. I’d give more. But he’s not top center yet. Suns won’t be overpaid just cause they ask. Ayton wants to leave. He can just take his qualifying offer next yr. And leave the following yr. So if there is a rift. It’s best to do a sign n trade this yr for Suns.
I’m an old time Knicks fan, Mitchell, point guard, not EQ, 1st round pick, future 1st..phx may want 2nd also—— Thibs was right, should have resigned bullock—suffocating D game 7, great 3 &D player
His unselfishness has been greatly understated. CP3 is great for Aytons effi oency but terrible for his potential growth. Ayton loves shooting jumpers. That’s not necessarily a great thing but his passion for it is being suppressed.
Clint Capela money no more or itll be regret
If he gets offered Clint Capela money the Suns fans will regret it when he’s putting 24 and 12 with the Pistons or Blazers. Robert Sarver will be happy though with his extra 10-15 million.
Coach of the year. It’s like calling Monty a all-star when he played lol. What a joke
I said this might happen last year, and he might get offered something just to put Phoenix in a position to make a decision, especially with them being almost capped out, but that is the only reason someone would pay him more than $16-18 million, or maybe as high or higher than $22 million…which would be poor decision making by those teams
He doesnt feel valued? By a team that picked him number 1 overall. The team that played him way too many minutes in the NBA finals, costing themselves a championship, so he wouldn’t feel bad…sounds like he is kind of being greedy, and is salty other players that are worth more than him got paid more than him.
While Ayton has significantly improved, mostly b/c of Chris Paul and the pieces around him, he is expendable. Unless you are certain guys, paying bigs more than a certain amount isnt conducive to building a winning roster, especially when you can get comparable options for very little. That being said, they might have to do so, depending on the position they’re in, but they should definitely at least explore the idea of seeing what they might be able to get for him, if they do end up on that position. That’s not unlike what I said the couple of years, but I havent seen anything to suggest anything has really changed
I am not fogeting when Ayton was comedic on defense, an arm-waver. He is getting help from Crowder as well as Paul.
He is a standstill player without optimal bend, does not have the drbbling & movement of Embiid & Jokic.
The Suns do not have max money available. He should get well-paid, but agent vanity and the market will likely lead to a trade away.
Predict Suns will suffer more from a Paul decline than an Ayton replacement.
I do agree with those who say that various parties have been too hard on him. But some of those, he hired.