The Bulls and Heat both have interest in potential sign-and-trade deals for Warriors forward Jonathan Kuminga, league sources tell Michael Scotto of HoopsHype. Kuminga, who’s eligible for restricted free agency in two weeks, is looking for an “expanded and consistent role” after watching his playing time with Golden State fluctuate throughout the season and the playoffs, Scotto adds.
Scotto notes that the Warriors engaged in trade talks with Chicago regarding center Nikola Vucevic prior to February’s deadline. He now has a $21.48MM expiring contract, and he would provide Golden State with the scoring big man it has been lacking.
Vucevic will turn 35 in October, but he has remained durable and productive, appearing in 73 games this season and averaging 18.5 points, 10.1 rebounds and 3.5 assists in 31.2 minutes per night. Vucevic also shot 40.2% from three-point range and would appear to be a comfortable fit in Steve Kerr’s offense.
Scotto states that the 22-year-old Kuminga would be a much better fit than Vucevic for a Bulls team that wants to get younger. He fills an obvious need as an athletic power forward, and he would have a chance to put up big numbers in Billy Donovan’s up-tempo system.
Scotto describes Kuminga as a “fallback option” for Miami, which is placing a greater priority on Bucks star Giannis Antetokounmpo if he becomes available while working to acquire Kevin Durant from the Suns. If those pursuits fall through, the Heat could turn their attention to Kuminga as they search for more talent to combine with Bam Adebayo and Tyler Herro.
Kuminga wasn’t able to reach an extension agreement with the Warriors last summer, but he looked ready to be a long-term fixture with the team before suffering a severe right ankle sprain in early January that sidelined him for more than two months. By the time he returned, Golden State had traded for Jimmy Butler, which changed the dynamic of the organization.
Kuminga didn’t play at all in the Warriors’ final game, which they needed to win to avoid the play-in tournament, and he was barely used in the first round of the playoffs, except for a brief stretch when Butler was injured.
Regular playing time has been an ongoing issue for Kuminga, who met with Kerr during the middle of the 2023/24 season to express his frustrations. Scotto notes that Kuminga was involved in trade talks when Golden State had hopes of landing Durant in February, and there’s a sense that he might benefit from a change of teams.
Dear god no.
Hey man I dont want your Vucevic either
Thank you.
He makes too much it would be White or Ball in a trade.
I wouldn’t touch either of those 2 guys either.
White is horrendous defensively. Not a fit with Steph.
Ball was once a perfect fit for us, but now too unavailable.
only other player is Collins but he is a back up center unless the warriors get some draft picks like a couple of protected first rounders.
White would be a useful player. The big issue with him is that he is expiring and will get a bigger contract than Kumingas after this one cheap season.
You can also much much more easily do the TPE from Anderson with another small contract and a pick for White. Im guessing the Bulls want to keep him if theyre getting Kuminga too.
This is the Bulls fishing for a taker for Vuc, who cant play meaningful playoff min, and they werent able to dump at the deadline.
TPEs cannot be aggregated. Anderson TPE cannot be used to acquire anyone making over $8.8M or so.
From everything I am seeing TPE cant be combined. That doesnt mean that a team allowed to aggregate cant use a single TPE in combination with a players salary to absorb an incoming contract.
Im almost positive this has happened a bunch of times over the last several seasons where you can use an 8M TPE a 12M contract and acquire a 20M contract.
Well your memory isn’t serving you well because that would violate the current CBA. It hasn’t been possible for many years.
You are acting like JK is first team all NBA defense. Let’s be real. Lol
$20M on an expiring deal is too much Arc? Kuminga RFA deal would likely be around that $20M bench mark.
Can’t be over the amount the warriors paid him last year. So the contract would need to be under $12 million they can take back. Unless they add Buddy going to Chicago in the deal.
Arc I just want a new head coach lmao and hopefully take Queen at 12 next week.
They have the Anderson TPE around 8M from the Jimmy deal. I think if I remember correctly you can combine a TPE with a contract you just cant combine TPEs or else teams would just sign min deals and trade them until they had a 20M TPE.
@Raz
Vuc is not a good player. He was scorching from 3 for 6 weeks and then spent the season making 30% from 3 after that. He is big, and he can shoot, but Quentin Post will be a better shooter, and is already almost as good on D, and costs like 1.7M.
If Im going to spend assets and salary on a stretch 5 its not going to be for one that is barely better for 8X the salary of the one I already have.
Nobody including the GSW was willing to give anything of value for Vuc at the deadline.
Chap, Oh I know Vuc’s value is terrible, I blame AK for that. I just don’t see GSW/Bulls being a logical trade partner. If they are so invested heavily on Post’s growth, Vuc wouldn’t be the right fit for that roster. I think a guy like Mitchell Robinson would fit well for that team on P&R and rim protection/board help.
They could use a 4 that could shoot like Naz over a 5 I think. You can play Dray at the 5 easier if you have a shooting 4 with size. It opens up the options a lot since theres only a couple 3/D 5s in the NBA but a lot more 3/D 4s.
The sad thing is I wouldnt be shocked if they add a year or two to Vuc deal.
Please don’t put that in the universe. I’ll lose my sh*t lol.
For reals. Some 2/35M BS thats just as un tradable as the current one.
Kuminga’s deal will count for full value for the receiving team, but it’s only worth 50% of that to the Warriors. So they’ll likely be limited to someone in the $10-15M range.
This is hilarious, well done. Made me chuckle. Lol
Don’t you guys have pedo Giddley though. Can’t get worse than that, on or off court.
I wouldn’t blame Giddey for that when the girl lied about her age with a fake ID to get into a club.
@ raz. I’m with you 100%. These warriors fans get way to attached to their own. So much so they’re absolutely blinded by how much better their team could be. Half of them wanted to keep Wiggins over Jimmy. Bulls are better off with a pick than Kuminga. Awful fit.. ironically it’s probably vuch who is Chicago’s most consistent guy from deep. Patrick Williams is more the Kuminga level.
2 B fair. I think most of us were hesitant with Jimmy not because it wasnt easy to see that he is a better basketball player than Wiggins. It was simply about the way things were going in MIA and his injury history/age being the one place Wiggins was way ahead.
Wiggins availability was absolutely killing the Warriors man. Half the time Wiggins was available he was present in body only going through the motions. Warriors won’t miss Kuminga and who knows, maybe due to age Bulls could attach something via way of draft capital. Every game in Oracle should be treated as Steph’s last. As in, a little sense of urgency might be best.
Lol this guy is going to be having a stare down in Pat Riley’s office by December. Kuminga is not a buy-in to the kool-aid type of guy. He’s a me-first player.
He is not a me first player but highly incionsistent player. Some games he can dominate and others meh. He has done everything warriors asked of him.
Why would the warriors feel the need to go out and trade for Jimmy butler if Kuminga is doing everything they’ve asked of him?
Kuminga was injured and not ready to contribute at the time and the warriors were desperate to make the playoffs.
Ok but then they gave Jimmy an extension?
That was to get him to come to the warriors. Its only through teh Curry years when Green and Curry plan to retire.
Because you dont let assets expire in the NBA when you cant replace them if your over the cap. Jimmy might just be matching for KD/Giannis or what not, and is probably worth most of what they paid him. Im guessing he still would get 2/80M so his contracts only slightly over paying his production.
Jimmy might not be the fit, but if he isnt you need his contract to go get the player that fits better.
It’s also hard to be consistent as a young guy on this Warriors team. Look at all the young talent they’ve brought in over the years and fail to develop. And he can’t develop unless they are willing to actually give him play time in moments that matter.
He isnt me first, but he does chafe at not getting the chance he thinks he deserves, even if he hasnt earned it yet.
Its like, do the things we tell you we need you to, like rebounding and staying locked in on defense, and kid will touch the court plenty in every game.
In his defense, he is under pressure to get paid. The amount of minutes he gets and the numbers he puts up can be the difference of tens of millions of dollars in a contract. Curry, Green, Butler, those guys all have had massive contracts and made way north of $100 million in their careers. He hasn’t yet.
Do you really think in contract negotiations Dunleavy sitting across from him would go “You were a good team player and hustled hard and didn’t complain while on the bench at the end of games for that you’ll get a max extension” or is he going to scrutinize his time on the floor and stats for a lower contract? I think we all know it’s the latter. As a 22 year old with that kind of pressure he handled it as best as could be expected.
I mean one of the biggest problems GSW have with building a top team around Steph, is Steph. Nobody mentions that him being the NBAs highest paid player who made 39.6% of the salary cap last season is why the team cant just fill out the roster. He also has a billion dollar clothing brand he owns so he shouldnt need an extra 10M, but he has already been extended for the next 2 years for nearly 130M.
The thing though is the coaching staff has publicly said if JK does the things we ask of him he wont be on the bench. His shooting is spotty, and would really help if he improved from 3. The thing is he doesnt crash the glass and rebound, he falls asleep on defense or over helps and gets beat backdoor or gives up an open corner 3 when it happens, and when he does get the ball he almost always goes iso post up instead of just passing it when he doesnt have a good shot and then moving off ball to either get himself or someone else open. He already does enough to earn playing time now, but imagine how much more he would play if he did what the coaches asked instead of working on his turn around fade aways.
I think he is misreading where the NBA is contract wise. Right now if your a star role player you will get paid and be worth more in a trade right now than the guys who are lower level stars. Be Alex Caruso and you will never be out of work and will out earn your baseline stats on every contract. Kuminga could do that, while also putting up much better base stats than Caruso.
Chapman, I think your Kuminga take is way off.
They offered him 5 years for $150M at the beginning of the season. That is not telling somebody to be a role player.
He was their 2nd best player in 2023-24. Dunleavey said so publicly. Look at his stats as a starter.
There is one issue: the coach.
5/150M was what his camp was looking for in an extension. They never offered more than 100M total Im almost certain. If they had been close to what he wanted in an extension it would have gotten done.
He was their second best scorer. Draymond did way more in overall production. Wiggins also missed most of that season with his dads illness, so congrats you were the second best scorer over Klay Thompson who had a horrific slump mid year and got benched. I mean its not that much of an accomplishment to be the second scorer on a 10 seed that gets bounced after 1 playoff game.
I think Kerr is at times too hard on him, and doesnt let him play through stuff enough, but the last couple years the team has had no margin for error just trying to scrape out of the play in, so I get it some. Kuminga is more of the problem than Kerr I think. I think he has been told very clearly the things he can do to play more, but they arent the types of things the type of player he wants to be does.
Its like Aaron Gordon where sometimes you need to find out a few times you arent going to be “the guy” before you maximize your game by being the best guy you can be even in a supporting role.
Not a me-first player, but still raw.
Kuminga is a “development hindered by Kerr” player. Don’t twist it any other way.
“Me first”? Where? More like “being 21 and being told to “go out there and vibe” and then getting blamed for losing when he doesn’t know what that even means”
Kerr is really, really bad at his job, you guys. It’s been 3 years and all he gets are excuses from people who could have coached the Hamptons 5 themselves to 75-7 + 16-1.
I have a trade idea 2 weeks ago
Kuminga for Huerter and 12th pick
Huerter has a bad contract
FYI
Warriors are not allowed to use $9 million TPE
Due up first tax apron
Huerter doesn’t fit the warriors team.
Correct.
Send his expiring contract to the third team and take more salary
Warriors CAN use the TPE. It hard caps them at the First Apron, but if they move Kuminga, that won’t be an issue.
Hard to say what his value is since nobody knows how much the other teams are offering him. I do know they do not want Patrick Williams from the bulls. If heat added Jovic in atrade teh warriors would do it.
Kuminga is a better player than Jovic
His value is impossible to work into a deal this offseason.
With base year compensation rules if he signs for 30M in CHI GSW can only take back 15M in salary. I dont see any players on CHI that make roughly half what JK would on a new contract who are close to as good right now. They will just keep him into the season unless he is part of the outgoing package on a much bigger deal with a star returning. BYC goes away in Dec.
Its such a tough needle to thread where Kumingas fit isnt ideal, but he is still talented, and the team cant just jettison him for nothing. You need to be at least as good as you are with Kuminga after the trade, and the receiving team has to take about twice the salary in that you send out. Basically its too complicated outside BRK wanting him, and far more likely in season where if you sign him to a contract around 3/70 once your allowed to trade him he has value on that deal and you can send 23M and take back 23M.
I agree that because of how the money in return trade works, he will likely stay in GS; plus, there will be no need then to keep him on the bench and not give him minutes, so we might see him play more, which would benefit GS – increase his value. And then trade him later.
But I would very much like to see him playing in Chicago on day 1 of the season.
Also, 3/70 sounds a bit low, I think he’ll get more. He wanted more in the first place and didn’t sign the extension because of that.
Peter, agree with this take, including that 3/70 is too low.
Bobby Marks was on Bay Area radio this week, and predicted Warriors will offer $80M for 2 years with a 3rd year player option. That sounds about right to me.
No F-ing way…
There is no world where Kuminga gets 40M per. None. That deal would be un tradable. On top your giving him a PO Im guessing at the same. So instead of getting him for the 5/150M he wanted your going to pay him 3/120M?
Im guessing no team in the league gives him over 25M AAV, and only one besides GSW can offer more than the MLE. His only leverage is taking the QO and aiming for FA next season.
Chap, you are right, that was a typo! It was on Willard and Dibs, 95.7 The Game, a couple of days ago.
Marks said 3 years for $81M with the 3rd year a player option.
$25M, $27M, $29M over the 3 years
I think he very much could be gone in Dec though if it isnt working perfect.
I think its too low, but I just heard I think Dunc on or Game Theory talking about him at like 4/60 where Im like at that price I love the deal. 15M per seems insane for him to take over longer years, but a lot of those guys have team and agent sources so maybe thats what the word is. Also he has so little leverage since the only team that can just offer him what he wants is BRK so he cant really get a second bidder. His agent will Im sure talk to other teams about what deal they would do in a S&T so they will know what the market for him is contract wise even if they cant leverage it to get more. If they hear the offers arent much better he could sign a pretty team friendly deal.
Chapman- you are normally A+ on these things, but you’re off here. You’re not looking at it the way that teams and agents do, which is this: no way in the world will Kuminga sign a 4yr/$15M deal for $60M per year. And he has a lot of leverage right now.
He can take a 1 year deal for $9M (only $6M less than the $15M) with the Warriors if he doesn’t like any of the offers, and then be a UFA in 1 year on a wide open market. Even if he sits out the year, at 22 years and with 4 seasons already in the NBA, he will get an offer at least double that $60M you mention.
And if Kuminga decides to sign for the $9M, the Warriors’ ability to exchange him for an asset as valuable as his ability vanishes forever. Catastrophic.
This is a scenario that the CBA enables, and that all parties are aware of. We haven’t seen it in the NBA because it would reflect financial malpractice by a team.
Kuminga and his agent, Aaron Turner, have leverage. If the Warriors go too far below a target number, they sign a 1 year deal and wait for next summer.
I didnt say 4/60 people far more plugged in than me did lols. I thought that still sounded too low even if he struck out everywhere.
Taking the 1 year means if he tears an ACL on a dunk attempt your not just taking less next year but not taking any of the future money. Like 60M+ is never have to work again money for a guy thats made like 17M total on his rookie deal.
If he causes to many problems sitting out healthy he will get docked all the money, and no teams will want to sign him. He can ask Ben Simmons how holding out has worked for his career.
If he takes a 1/9M deal than he doesnt have much salary matching value, but probably has more trade value since teams always think they will get him signed to a deal they like once they get him. Tyler Herro was worth way more the year before his deal was signed than he was once teams thought he was overpaid.
Is he really going to turn down 75M for 9M? The problem with betting on yourself is you turn down enough money for your entire family to be taken care of for life.
I dont think the league values him that highly. They all see him as what he is. A very talented young player with sky high potential. He also has a bunch of deficiencies that he has made very little progress fixing. I think other teams may think the GSW have messed his development up some, but he also has had long stretches of playing time and several offseasons, but is still pretty close to the player he was year one and really hasnt made much progress. Other teams that have respect for Mike D/Kerr/Meyers think he might not be very coachable since he has been publicly told what the team wants from him, but for whatever reason hasnt done it.
The level of low the contract has to be for them to take the one year is really low. I think only one player has ever opted for the QO. The offer from GSW will probably be in the neighborhood of what the real market for him is, and his agent should be in touch with other teams trying to work out a S&T, so if nobody is going over 80M on any contract no matter where he goes 75M doesnt sound so bad. He also knows that if he does break out theres maybe no team more willing to just pay up to keep talent than GSW.
> Taking the 1 year means if he tears an ACL on a
> dunk attempt your not just taking less next year but
> not taking any of the future money.
Not the concern you imagine. Any NBA player with an agent in Kuminga’s position will have a specialty insurance policy to cover risk of injury in these situations. There are a bunch of firms that agents and athletes work — Petersen International, Everest, PFS, etc.
In the 3% chance that Kuminga gets injured this season on a 1 year deal, he should still be set up for life under a normal person’s standards.
Those insurance policies cost quite a lot, and sometimes dont pay that much. Also the policy cant value future contracts that havent been signed as anything. Like you cant insure yourself against your FA value since that is variable and not pre determined at the time of the policy.
I have never heard of a player having one. I know teams do, especially in MLB on some of the super big deals, but I think it would have been reported for instance if GSW had one on Curry when he broke his hand.
He could also just play worse than last year so that no team wants to give him more than the 1 year MLE. With the cap and aprons its a game of musical chairs and if your not one of the guys who go first your value can really fall. Tyus Jones I think thought he was getting at least 12M/Y last year and then took the vet min.
Chap, respectfully, most of the above is false, most notably that you can’t insure against contracts yet to be signed. In fact, that’s the primary purpose of these policies.
Where there’s a lot of money and risk, you will find financial instruments for risk mitigation. If you do some research into the companies I named, you’ll see how pervasive these policies are.
Chap, you can look up “Loss of Value” insurance policies to learn more. The NCAA makes sure all likely first round draft picks get them, which should be easy to find. These same players typically get another policy when rookie extensions are imminent.
Agencies push their players to get them because players tend to be irrationally fearful of injury, which leads to irrational risk aversion about contract terms.
A loss of value policy is usually paid out when a player gets a career ending injury. It is an add on to disability insurance policy usually for permanent disability. Most of them have values between 1-10M.
With Kuminga these things would complicate it:
Loss of value usually is less applicable if you miss part of a season with a more minor injury.
Loss of value usually is far less than the numbers that we are talking 150M etc
Loss of value claims will only be paid if you are able to prove the amount of loss that you are claiming could be reasonably expected to be achieved. It would be very hard for him to claim he would have made 150M if not for a injury. Thats where with these you get something if your career ends, but its probably not a huge amount unless you have already established a high earning potential prior to the policy.
This all is before considering the costs of a policy with a value of 150M which would be much much more expensive premiums than one with only a 1M max payout. You can insure anything, J Lo did her @ss once upon a time, but it can be prohibitively expensive to get a really premium policy that pays out fat.
I cant insure a 150M contract that doesnt exist. Like you might be able to get a big life insurance policy that uses past earnings and projected future earnings as a basis for its value, but you cant insure a contract that doesnt exist.
If you remember there was a company trying to sign athletes several years ago that got a few prominent baseball prospects to sign where they got up front money for a % of their future career earnings. I think it collapsed eventually when they didnt have enough demand for the shares of the athletes earnings. This was an attempt to score an investment vehicle out of trying to solve this problem for younger players.
I know that you can basically get a policy on just about anything, but some of them are just wild premiums without very good payouts where the policy is simply not worth the cost.
> If he causes to many problems sitting out healthy
> he will get docked all the money, and no teams will
> want to sign him.-
I wasn’t suggesting he would cause problems during this 1 year deal. But there is the chance that the team would not want to use him because he’s gone at the end of the season.
>Even if he sits out the year, at 22 years and with 4 seasons already in the NBA, he will get an offer at least double that $60M you mention.
I would think the only way he sits out is without the teams consent. They would then take back the money, and he would poison his market.
He has to be better than this last season to improve the offers, and on the injury front he missed over 1/3 of this season off just an ankle sprain that cost him 3 months and limited him when he returned still.
Chapman, you’re wasting your powerful brain on this!
There’s no way Kuminga is signing a multi-year deal in the teens. And the Warriors know that.
Its not just JK I think though. Thats what I mean. Like the market could be a lot lower on a lot of guys than people think.
This is the first season that all the 2nd apron penalties kick in. So now draft picks get frozen, the new super repeater kicks in etc. I think the pool of money out there since almost all the good teams are right against or over the second apron and even a number of rebuilding teams POR/TOR types are super expensive. Theres a ton of young players with new big contracts either about to kick in or about to be signed. I just think the pool of available money across the NBA is super shallow right now and a lot of guys are going to get less than they thought.
This should be a temporary problem with the tax going up by 10% its already rising like 15M this year and is compounding going forward, so I think the current log jam will clear over the next couple years.
I think Kuminga doesnt want to take a deal that low. I just dont know if he can drive up his market over 20M per by much in the current market with RFA and no cap teams. To be fair though I think 25M is about his max right now from almost any team.
He is a lot like BI where dude is good, but a hard player to fit onto a winning roster. BI is good but not good enough to go and build a whole roster around maximizing. Now he did just get 40M per, but I think Masai was on crack to give him that deal, and kinda hate most of the roster construction and contracts in TOR. Like they are trying super hard to be a second apron lottery team right now.
At 4/60, he is easily better off signing the qualifying offer. It isn’t even close, the qualifying offer and free agency (true free agency and a no trade clause for one year) is better than that.
4/60 is the MLE. Some teams project to have cap space next year. That can change with trades, FA this offseason, and extensions. I dont know if he gets more than 4/68M next year, since options will be limited who can give more than the 4/68 thats the max a non tax MLE team can give. Any more than that and your in cap space team territory which will probably still only be a couple teams, and we dont know if any of the cap teams will want him.
In the NBA your a max guy, an MLE or below guy, and a few guys making well over the MLE but well below the max who are good starters.
I could easily see something like 3/75M or the 4/95M Pat Williams deal being the most he can get right now.
Green got 3/105 in Houston. I’d rather have Kuminga than Green. I think a deal in that neighbourhood is what Kuminga can realistically sign.
Green has lost a lot of shine in the last year though. I would take Kuminga now over Green, but I also think teams would make HOU pay to take Green. They are both defensively deficient scorers, but at least Green has more juice on ball and off ball spot up shooting. JK is better at post ups, and has the physical skills to be a better defender if he ever gets his IQ up and cares more on D.
I think fair value on JK is like the Green deal in an unrestricted market with no cap. So when he has no teams to leverage them he gets less.
He was reportedly offered 5/150, but he turned it down and then didn’t play well enough to get that much on the open market. Something like 4/100 is more like it in the open market or for S&T.
Kerr has done every single thing he can to ruin Kuminga’s development. He literally played 2W guys who werent in the long term plans over him. I would keep him and fire Kerr, for proving over 10 years he cannot develop any NBA talent at all. Kuminga has all the tools, Kerr just straight up refused to help him succeed and made him play with scrubs.
I can’t figure out Kerr.
That is true, Kuminga is basically the same player he was when he entered the league, with little to no development in the first 4 years.
I think there was a decision on the organisation level to not play him more minutes at certain points during his time in GS. And Kerr’s decision to put him in the corner this season, which also hindered him, looks like that one was conscious as well.
You just cant let him go soak up all the usage and make mistakes when your barely staying in the playoff picture as is, and teams 4-11 are separated by like 3 total games.
Kerr’s was made by the fact that the Warriors offense sucked with Kuminga starting.
What are you struggling with? It is pretty easy.
This is always what people who watched Kuminga highlight reels say. For every athletic dunk, there were three times he he got in the way of the offense, a couple more where he was a black hole who wouldn’t pass the ball, and multiple times he was a traffic cone on defense. He’s very inconsistent at best.
He also leaves his man a lot when they are off ball. Like sooooo many of the open 3s that get given up are when Kuminga is in the paint for no reason helping Dray when he doesnt need it and his guy gets the wide open kick out.
You aren’t incorrect, but I’m saying literally all of that inconsistency is 100% due to Kerr not giving him a strict role or even being “run the offense through him” and he’s played elite defense at times too. He just needs the run that Podz got and was allowed to be bad til he came good with. Why did Podz get unlimited chances but Kuminga got none?
A lot of smokescreens and misinformation at this time of year so I am taking all rumors with a grain of salt.
The Bulls are a curious fit to me. Can Kuminga and Patrick Williams play together? Can they really go into the season with Zach Collins and Jalen Smith as their center rotation? Maybe. If the goal is playing faster with Lonzo and Giddey throwing hit-ahead passes it makes some sense to cash out on Vooch while he’s healthy and on the final year of his deal.
Heat – the matching salary coming back for Kuminga would likely be Duncan Robinson’s fully guaranteed final year plus a few second rounders, or Kyle Anderson and Jamie Jaquez. I don’t think the money works for the Warriors to reaquire Wiggins.
Aside from Kerr, Wiggins is a big reason why GSW didn’t win the finals the last 3 years, the delusion he could be a #2 behind Steph was always something that drove me insane. He legit is not a good player outside of like 3 months in 2022, and 2022 GSW had a Strength in Numbers roster, proving he is a grifter in this league. Miami’s play after Wiggs joined proves he isn’t a gamechanger in any type of way.
If only Kerr simply played Kuminga with his best 4 other players, instead of rookies and 2W guys, Kuminga would have been developed faster and it would be slam dunk decision to extend and keep him.
Bulls look like a great fit. They’ve been stuck on the playoff fringe for a few years and they may see JK as a chance to take a swing for the fences.
warriors are not taking Wiggins back because of his money. Not sure if Heat is willing to give Duncan up but if they did Duncan and give back the warriors 1st rounder it could work.
I mean Wiggins would at least be a fit in that he is as valuable as Kuminga on court for them. I dont think his deal is awful and his fit is much better as a more pure 3/D player. I do think Wiggins is declining though, where he isnt as good as he was in 22 anymore.
With Wiggins if they sign Kuminga to 30M/y though you still need to add 12M in salary on top of Kuminga to match Wiggins money, but MIA have to take back almost 45M in salary that they dont have a mechanism to facilitate.
i think that is what most people do not understand the warriors only get about $12 million back in a contract so its j going to be draft pick heavy coming back. Maybe a 1st rounder and some 2nd rounders.
They dont want the picks though I dont think. The only way future picks would help the Curry 2 year window is if they get re traded as soon as you get them. Kuminga has value on this team as one of the 3 best scorers even with his other issues.
You need to get another player that provides more value than Kuminga but makes probably half the money he will next year. I think theres maybe 4 guys that are touchable in the league who fit the bill.
Now if Kuminga is just part of a much bigger trade thats a whole different story.
The picks could be useful as trade assets. Whatever player(s) the Dubs get back on a Kuminga S&T would NOT be the end of the moves they want to make this off-season.
I dont know that you would get all that much back pick wise though. Like a lottery protected first or a bunch of seconds doesnt give you much more ammo.
Arc89 I wouldn’t do it, but how about this take: Wiggins for Kuminga this February.
Miami wants a more aggressive bucket-getter. Here’s why the Warriors want Wiggins:
1. very team-friendly contract at ~ $26M/yr.
2. fits perfectly at SG alongside Steph, Jimmy and Draymond.
– shoots almost 40% from deep
– much better wing defender than Podz
– with both Jimmy and Draymond, you don’t need a great ball-handler in the backcourt along with Steph. Podz can focus on being a backup PG, 6th man
3. Kerr adores Wiggins.
Now I know hes had a bunch of stuff outside BBall the last few seasons, but Wiggins production has been declining so…
I think once the BYC expires you want to look for a player like Wiggins thats younger. I want Trey Murphy and would pay quite a few picks along with Kuminga to get him, but yeah something more like that.
That’s probably the kind of thing they’re working on as a backup plan. If no S&T, match any reasonable offer Kuminga gets as a RFA, then reassess the situation once he’s tradeable w/o restrictions. Wiggins would certainly be welcomed back, though there would certainly be lots of other possibilities.
Seems Indiana has shown NBA teams who press full court & who always take off running on offense can win. Maybe the Bulls are looking for such, hopefully other teams will play this all out style too. It’s certainly a breath of fresh air to see teams play full out but maybe Indiana is a special case as it’s so much easier for players to walk the ball up & just defend half court.
Indiana also shows the value in developing players others gave up on. Halliburton, Toppin, and Nesmith were all drafted by other teams and traded away.
Kuminga is very good in that “pick the other guy as high up the court as possible and make it hard for him to even get to your 3-pt line”. That’s his biggest strength on defense, I’ve seen him do as good a job as Nesmith in that capacity, maybe sometimes even better. His physicality is better than Nesmith’s or even Mathurin’s.
I think of those guys as more Moody types. They were interesting talented players who were getting log jammed on teams without room to play them. Moody just kept getting screwed by being down the depth chart. Maybe hes a little Toppin like since that was one where Thibs just seemed to not jive with him.
GSW isnt dumping him for nothing. Like in what world is JK worth Robinsons negative value contract and a couple seconds.
The money doesnt work anywhere with BYC its almost impossible to find a player GSW would value enough to not just sign Kuminga and revisit trading him in dec.
Chapman, here’s a critical factor: while Kerr is operating on 1 or 2 year timeline, Lacon and Dunleavey are also planning for what comes after. It’s a huge concern.
It strengthens your point. Kuminga is not going to be given away.
I think that Lacob at least hopes they sign him, and he can fit a bit better than he has, till Curry leaves and he becomes one of your core moving forward.
100%
I could see the Chicago deal, neither guy fits the team or timeline they are on.
The Bulls finally move out the last or their “big 3” (being sarcastic, Vuc, DD and Zach were a terrible fit) and taking a flyer on a young player who might have some upside should be what the Bulls are looking for.
Vuc is a good fit for the geriatric Warriors. They have the defence to cover Vuc’s shortcomings on that end, and his fit as a big man 3 point bomber is obvious.
I don’t see Miami grabbing him, he’s not really a Pat Riley type player.
Kuminga does not fit well into this roster. We have too many not shooters or not good enough shooters (Dalon Terry/Julian Phillips etc). Also, him and Buzelis would never work because of spacing and shooting. Buzelis needs all the development he can get during his rookie year and getting JK will hinder his development. What we need is an actual athletic young big, rather than temu version of TJ Warren who can’t shoot from outside and is a porous FT shooter.
Good scoring does not equal high percentages from behind the arc. Kuminga is an efficient scorer. He can finish around the rim as good as just about any wing in the league. Even if the paint is not open, and there’s Rudy Gobert under the basket.
Shooting percentages get too much attention. I never understand drafting shooters; having good shooters does not translate into being in control of the game and playing well. Phoenix have good shooters and were one of the best 3pt% teams in the league, yet they played mostly poorly and were what my coach used to describe as “they let basketball happen to them”.
Kuminga has many qualities that translate into playing good basketball. He’d be a good bet for a team like Chicago that needs talent. And Kuminga is very young too.
I don’t think Kuminga would hinder Buzelis’ development. But Buzelis should be a priority, of course. If the Bulls, who see and talk to Matas daily, with data and everything they have, decide that a player like Kuminga would impede his development, then JK should not be signed.
If you cant space then you have less driving lanes. His handle is still not good enough to drive in traffic and finish with a good shot it will be some contested turn around. He also would be higher efficiency but his FT shooting is poor so he gives back a lot of the easiest points he generates.
You can have good player that arent good outside shooters, but it makes it harder to get enough shooting on the court when they are a 1-3 where you mostly get your shooting from, and JK wants to be a 3 even if he fits more as a 4-5 offensively.
Whine, whine, whine, yawn, yawn, yawn…People want to crap all over Kerr about Kuminga. Kerr is the worst head coach ever. So, why did his peers vote him the 15th Greatest Coach in NBA history. The problem with Kuminga, and the Warriors, is spacing. When Kerr initially tried to start Kuminga, in 23-24, it was a disaster. The team had +/- rating of -24. Draymond was supposed to come off the bench, and he accepted it. Draymond was forced to play the 5 and it was a success. They started off the 24-25 season with Wiggins/Kuminga/Podz/Davis starting. Kuminga/Podz/Davis all had regressed. It led to lineup changes. Melton got hurt. Curry was double teamed. Kuminga wasn’t a lot of help. Prior to the All-Star break, the Warriors were 17th in offensive rating. After break, and Butler trade, they rose to 9th. As Curry said, playing with Jimmy made things “easy”. Why would you want to make things hard on your best offensive player? Oh…And the belief that Kuminga rode the bench all season long is false. He averaged 24 minutes a night, down 2 from the previous season.
Resident Kerr sycophant with the fast copy/paste.
@aristotle
and you are the worst poster here in Hoopsrumors with ShaqFoo as your burner.
I have always been a big Kuminga guy. But he hasn’t proven anything yet. All the rumors say a contract would start at 25 mil. Which will be all based on upside. In the right offense for him. He can probably be a 20 pt scorer. He still has a lot of growing up to do. So it would take the right team and situation. Watrybiggest trade chip to improve team is Kuminga. So they must do this right …..
A question for all the cap gurus !!!!
If Warriors sign Kuminga to 28 mill a yr. Can they then trade him for equal value at TD in February??.
Imo Nets Claxton is a better trade for Kuminga.
> If Warriors sign Kuminga to 28 mill a yr. Can they then
> trade him for equal value at TD in February??.
Yes and that’s a very plausible scenario.
Kuminga might be the most overhyped young player in the league. S&T him to the Hornets or something and ship him off into NBA purgatory.
Mark Williams and Grant Williams in return for Kuminga.
^ pure trolling
How is Kuminga overhyped? For a young player with his upside, and playing in GS, there’s not that much talk and hype around him.
Peter- phillyballers trolls every thread. Don’t take the bait.
We all talk about him way more than his production has warranted, myself included. He gets media coverage when hes mad at the coach, talked about like a major trade chip, and hyped like a 1st overall pick thats underperforming.
Like really outside his draft position and playing on one of the most covered teams, how is he really much different from Cam Thomas? I dont think Cams getting some 100M+ deal this offseason either.
His positives jump off the page, but hes still so far from a complete player. Theres a lot of dudes in the NBA that can put up numbers on a bad team, but really arent ever going to be one of your main guys on a title team.
Ok, Aristotle, what is inaccurate about what I stated? What did I copy and paste?
We’ll take Ware for Kuminga. The ship has sailed for Vucevic-to-Dubs; we’ll take Giddey for Kuminga – throw Moody into the deal as well? Otherwise, I’m saving Kuminga for a potential Giannis or Jackson Jr. trade bonanza. Jackson Jr. teaming up on D with Dray and Jimmy?? Damn! Been thinking about that now since the Bane trade.
JJJ on GSW = title.
Dray for KD in a multi-teamer
Kuminga for JJJ
Jimmy, JJJ, KD and Steph = 70+ wins incoming
Hilarious…
Warriors ruined this kids value and now have to take what they can get for them, before watching them blossom on another team…
I do hope they end up with Vucevic to finally get their centre…
@Scarlett666 How did the Warriors ruin Kuminga’s value? They offered him $30m/year. He rejected that. He wanted more. Now, some will say he gets $25-$27m/year. He was inconsistent all year long. Some say he was pressing all year. Did the Warriors cause the ankle injury? It was his choice. Backup your claim.