Scoot Henderson

Blazers Announce Injury Updates On Henderson, Holiday

November 21st, 2025 at 7:49pm CST by Rory Maher

While third-year guard Scoot Henderson has made progress in his recovery from a torn left hamstring, he will be sidelined for at least two-to-four more weeks, which is when he’ll be reevaluated, the Trail Blazers announced in a press release.

The update on the former No. 3 overall pick was expected, as Henderson recently told Jason Quick of The Athletic that his return wasn’t imminent and his return to basketball activities was considered “week to week.” The 21-year-old point guard initially sustained the injury in late September during a workout before training camp.

Veteran guard Jrue Holiday, who was initially questionable for Friday’s contest at Golden State prior to being ruled out for his fourth straight game (Twitter link), will miss at least one more week with a right calf strain. According to the Blazers, the two-time All-Star will be checked out again in one-to-two weeks.

Holiday, a six-time All-Defensive member, was off to a solid start in his first season with Portland prior to the injury, averaging 16.7 points, 8.3 assists, 5.3 rebounds and 1.6 steals on .446/.365/.840 shooting in 12 games (33.4 minutes per contest).

While the press release doesn’t say anything about shooting guard Shaedon Sharpe, he will missed Friday’s game as well. It will be the high-flying Canadian’s second consecutive absence. Sharpe is, at least for now, considered day-to-day, writes Sean Highkin of The Rose Garden Report (Substack link).

The Trail Blazers have been hit hard by backcourt injuries this fall. Henderson has yet to play in 2025/26; Blake Wesley is expected to miss extended time after undergoing foot surgery earlier this month; Matisse Thybulle is three weeks removed from thumb surgery which was expected to sideline him for four-to-six weeks; and Damian Lillard is out for the season with a torn Achilles, though the front office knew that when it re-signed Portland’s all-time leading scorer.

After a 5-3 start, the Blazers have dropped six of their past seven games and are currently 6-9.

“It’s just part of the game,” acting head coach Tiago Splitter said earlier this week, per Highkin. “We’ve got to adapt a little bit, and we will. Find ways to win basketball games just like everybody else. You’ve seen all the guys that are out lately [around the NBA], and the teams that adapt better to those situations are the teams that do well. So that’s what we’ve got to do.”

Highkin takes a look at some options the team might consider in the wake of all the guard injuries, including applying for a hardship exception. It’s unclear if the Blazers would be granted the exception, Highkin notes, as it will depend on how much more time Thybulle is expected to miss.

Scoot Henderson’s Return Not Imminent

November 19th, 2025 at 9:02am CST by Luke Adams

It has been nearly eight weeks since the Trail Blazers announced that point guard Scoot Henderson had torn his left hamstring in a workout and would miss the start of the 2025/26 season.

At the time, the team said Henderson was expected to resume basketball activities in about four-to-eight weeks. However, while the former No. 3 overall pick tells Jason Quick of The Athletic that he has “made a lot of progress” in his recovery, his return to the court isn’t imminent and he says his resumption of basketball activities remains “week to week.”

According to Henderson, he’s scheduled to meet this week with the team’s director of health and performance, Dr. Courtney Watson, who will determine next steps. So far, the third-year guard’s activities have been limited to some stationary shooting and dribbling and upper-body weight lifting.

“I can walk around to spots, but no jumping, no exploding,” Henderson explained to Quick. “I shoot free throws, some ball-handling, but without moving much.”

As Quick points out, Trail Blazers general manager Joe Cronin told reporters on media day in September that Henderson’s timeline for resuming basketball activities could extend to 10 weeks or even beyond that, since hamstring injuries can be “stubborn” and tricky to handle. For his part, Henderson is optimistic that once he’s cleared for full basketball activities, he won’t require an extended ramp-up period before he’s cleared to play in games.

“I feel like I will be good,” Henderson told The Athletic. “I feel like I’ve always been good like that (coming off injury). I’m sure I will be tired, because you can’t compare basketball activity with anything else, so for a few games I will feel it.”

The struggling Trail Blazers, who have lost five of their last six games to fall to 6-8 on the season, could use Henderson back in their lineup. In addition to missing Damian Lillard, who is out for the season with a torn Achilles, Portland is currently without Blake Wesley (out since Oct. 31 due to foot surgery) and Jrue Holiday (out the past two games due to right calf soreness), leaving the team thin at point guard.

Shaedon Sharpe and Deni Avdija have taken on increased ball-handling responsibilities during the past two games with Holiday out, while rookie two-way player Caleb Love has also entered the rotation. Love had a career-high 17 points in 32 minutes in Tuesday’s loss to Phoenix.

Blazers Exercise Options On Henderson, Clingan, Murray

October 21st, 2025 at 1:27pm CST by Luke Adams

A busy week of roster moves continues for the Trail Blazers, who announced in a press release that they’ve exercised their rookie scale team options on three players for the 2026/27 season. Those options are as follows:

Scoot Henderson (fourth year, $13,585,523)
Donovan Clingan (third year, $7,519,920)
Kris Murray (fourth year, $5,315,004)

Henderson, the third overall pick in the 2023 draft, hasn’t made the immediate impact that many experts anticipated, but he took a positive step forward in his second NBA season, averaging 12.7 points, 5.1 assists, and 3.0 rebounds per game on .419/.354/.767 shooting in 66 contests. The 21-year-old point guard currently recovering from a hamstring tear and will miss the start of the season.

Clingan, last year’s seventh overall pick, will take on an increased role in his second NBA season following the offseason departure of center Deandre Ayton. The former UConn standout averaged 6.5 points, 7.9 rebounds, and 1.6 blocks in 19.8 minutes per game last season, starting 37 of his 67 total outings.

Murray, the 23rd overall pick in 2023 out of Iowa, hasn’t done much offensively in two seasons for Portland, averaging 5.1 PPG and 1.1 APG on .406/.251/.558 shooting in 131 appearances (18.2 MPG). However, the 6’8″ forward is a versatile defender who could still have more room to grow.

Henderson and Murray will now be eligible for rookie scale extensions during the 2026 offseason, while the Blazers will have to decide on Clingan’s fourth-year option for 2027/28 (worth $9,550,298) by October 31, 2026.

The Blazers finalized a pair of four-year contract extensions on Monday for two key pieces of their long-term core, announcing new deals with Toumani Camara ($81MM) and Shaedon Sharpe ($90MM). Today’s moves ensure that all of Portland’s most important young players are under contract for at least the next two seasons.

Blazers Notes: Lillard, Henderson, Grant, Camara, Clingan, More

September 29th, 2025 at 4:05pm CST by Luke Adams

Asked at the Trail Blazers‘ media day on Monday if there’s any scenario in which he plays this season, Damian Lillard admitted it’s hard to envision making it back from his Achilles tear before the 2026/27 campaign.

“I don’t plan on it,” Lillard said of playing in ’25/26, per Sean Highkin of Rose Garden Report (Twitter link). “I feel like if this team is a one seed (without me), they probably got it. I’m trying to be as healthy as possible.”

Lillard added that the trainers and other players who have sustained Achilles injuries who have spoken to him about the recovery process have stressed patience and suggested that he shouldn’t be trying to make it back “in record time” (Twitter link via Highkin).

Although he almost certainly won’t be suiting up for the Trail Blazers this season, Lillard will still be one of the 15 players on the team’s standard roster, which head coach Chauncey Billups believes puts the longtime star point guard in a unique position when it comes to mentoring Portland’s younger players.

“He’s not a coach. He’s still a player. There’s a different level of connectivity that comes with that,” Billups said, noting that he wants Lillard to “keep a really close eye” on Shaedon Sharpe, Deni Avdija, and Scoot Henderson (Twitter link via Highkin).

Henderson, like Lillard, will be unavailable when the season begins, though his hamstring injury is only projected to keep him out for the start of the season, not all of it. Speaking on Monday to reporters, he referred to the injury as a “freak accident” and “minor setback” and said he’s still feeling positive about the season (Twitter links). Billups noted it’s a disappointing turn of events for the former No. 3 overall pick because he’d had an “incredible summer” prior to the injury (Twitter link).

Here’s more from the Blazers’ media day, via Highkin:

Billups said on Monday that there are “a lot of ways” the Trail Blazers’ starting lineup could go this fall and that the players who want starting jobs will have to earn them (Twitter link). Interestingly, when forward Jerami Grant was asked about the possibility of coming off the bench, he replied, “I don’t really expect that” (Twitter link). There had been some speculation this offseason that Grant could be asked to accept a reserve role due to the emergence of young forwards Avdija and Toumani Camara.
Speaking of Camara, he’s eligible to sign a contract extension but said on Monday that he’s leaving that up to his agent. “I’m just focused on basketball,” Camara said (Twitter link). “I’m trying to stay away from that right now. If I take care of my business on the court, everything will work itself out.”
With Deandre Ayton no longer in Portland, second-year center Donovan Clingan will be looking to play a major role. He said on Monday that he has worked on improving his conditioning and is aiming to average 30-plus minutes per night (Twitter link). Rookie big man Yang Hansen will be among the players vying for minutes in the middle, with Billups referring to the No. 16 overall pick as “right there in the mix” for minutes. “I think Hansen’s done a really good job of getting situated and understanding what we’re doing,” Billups said (Twitter link). “He’s definitely going to play.”
Big man Robert Williams, who underwent a procedure on his knee in March and has been limited to 26 games in two seasons since arriving in Portland, said he’s not sure when he’ll be cleared to play, though he and the training staff have a target date in mind (Twitter links).
Jrue Holiday and Matisse Thybulle are among the players who expressed enthusiasm on Monday about the defensive potential of the Blazers’ roster (Twitter links). “Playing games in your mind of what lineups we can put out there is pretty fun,” Thybulle said. “We have a few All-Defense-level players. I think we can put some ridiculous lineups out there.”

Blazers’ Scoot Henderson Suffers Torn Left Hamstring

September 26th, 2025 at 1:46pm CST by Rory Maher

Guard Scoot Henderson sustained a torn left hamstring during a workout this week, the Trail Blazers announced in a press release.

According to the team, Henderson is expected to resume basketball activities in four-to-eight weeks. Portland will provide additional updates on Henderson’s status “as appropriate.”

Crucially, the announcement doesn’t say that Henderson is expected to return in four-to-eight weeks — it’s just when he’ll resume basketball drills. It’s safe to say that, at minimum, Henderson will miss the start of his third NBA season.

A 6’3″ point guard, Henderson was a highly touted NBA prospect who spent two years with the now-defunct G League Ignite prior to being selected No. 3 overall in the 2023 draft.

Henderson got off to a pretty slow start as a rookie, putting up solid counting stats (14.0 points, 5.4 assists, 3.1 rebounds) but struggling with turnovers (3.4) and efficiency (.385/.325/.814 shooting line) in 62 games (28.5 minutes per contest).

While 21-year-old’s per-36 numbers were quite similar in year two, he showed improvement defensively, took a little better care of the ball, and was more efficient (.419/.354/.767 shooting) in 66 contests, most of which came in a reserve role (26.7 MPG).

The Blazers were already going to be shorthanded in the backcourt after re-signing franchise icon Damian Lillard, who was waived by Milwaukee after suffering a torn Achilles tendon in the playoffs, this offseason.

With Henderson out as well, offseason additions Jrue Holiday and Blake Wesley are candidates for more playing time at the point.

Jrue Holiday ‘Excited’ About Joining Blazers, Not Thinking About Retirement

September 22nd, 2025 at 12:01pm CST by Luke Adams

Although one report in June claimed that Jrue Holiday wasn’t thrilled about being traded from Boston to Portland, there has been no indication since then that the veteran guard is unhappy about his new situation. Speaking to DJ Siddiqi of RG.org, Holiday expressed enthusiasm about the coming season and about the talent on the Trail Blazers‘ roster.

“The goal is to win and to make some noise,” Holiday said. “I think that after the last few years of what has happened after Damian Lillard being traded — and then now Dame’s back — I think it’s an exciting time here in Portland. It’s an exciting time to be a Trail Blazer, and I’m excited to be part of it.”

Holiday, who has three years and $104.4MM left on his contract, was traded straight up for Anfernee Simons, who is on an expiring $27.7MM deal. It was a financially motivated move for the Celtics. For Portland, it was an opportunity to bring in a championship-winning veteran to lead by example for the team’s rising young guards, Scoot Henderson and Shaedon Sharpe, who are 21 and 22 years old, respectively.

“I don’t think y’all understand, like, Scoot and Shaedon are so athletic and so smart the way that they play the game,” Holiday told Siddiqi. “They’re going to be so good, and I feel like all they need is time. I feel like the time is now, because they have all the tools. I’m super excited to play with them.”

Holiday won’t be the only veteran mentor for those young guards — Lillard returned to the Blazers this summer after spending two years in Milwaukee, and head coach Chauncey Billups is a Hall of Famer who made five All-Star teams and won an NBA Finals MVP as a point guard. Holiday is looking forward to teaming up with both of them, noting that he admired how Billups played the game.

“I’m old enough to have watched him play,” Holiday said. “He was one of the guys who I wouldn’t necessarily say mirrored my game after. But I felt like I played similar to how he played. He was very smart, he was obviously more than solid on one side of the ball. The way that he thinks the game, I feel like I think the game the same way. … How he controlled the game just from his personality, and you can see as a coach, he’s kind of brought that over from as a player to a coach and instilled it.”

Billups spent 17 seasons playing in the NBA, which will be the benchmark that Holiday reaches in 2025/26. However, asked by Siddiqi how much longer he wants to play, the former UCLA standout suggested that retirement isn’t in his short-term plans.

“Just kind of going with it,” Holiday said. “I’ve been blessed enough to play for this long, and I’ve never taken that for granted. I know this is a dream come true for most young kids, but I know 17 years is a dream come true for any 35-year-old who gets a chance to stay as healthy as possible and to play the game that they love. I’ll just continue playing until I can’t anymore.”

Jrue Holiday Willing To Play Any Position For Blazers

July 29th, 2025 at 6:12pm CST by Dana Gauruder

Point guard Jrue Holiday believes he can coexist in a backcourt pairing with Scoot Henderson. Holiday, who was traded to the Trail Blazers by the Celtics in June, is projected as the starter alongside Shaedon Sharpe with Henderson likely playing a sixth man role.

“Scoot is aggressive,” Holiday said, per Sean Highkin of The Rose Garden Report (Substack link). “How he gets to the basket is amazing. Me being able to space the floor and shoot the three is something that will help him out. Being able to play off him and knowing that Scoot is the next one up and [helping him] showcase what he can do.”

Holiday doesn’t want to be pigeon-holed as a one-dimensional guard.

“I think I play every position,” he said. “I’ve proven that and shown that throughout my career. I’m a complete basketball player. You can’t put one position on someone, the way the game is changing now. Guys who have never played point guard are coming into the league and playing point guard. I’m a good fit with anyone.”

Holiday’s contract was the main reason for the deal from the Celtics’ perspective. Boston was looking to shed salary in order to escape the punitive second tax apron and Holiday will make $32.4MM next season and $104.4MM in total over the next three years.

Holiday is going from a perennial contender to an organization trying to get back into the playoffs for the first time since 2021. He’s hopeful Portland can take that step next season.

“[I’m coming in] not just help out as much as possible, but try to win,” he said. “They have a great coaching staff that have done a lot, and a Hall of Fame coach in Chauncey (Billups). But I think as a current player who’s been through it not too long ago, as far as going through the struggle to win a championship, I still have that feeling and that itch. I’m closer to what that feeling is and how hard it is to actually win.”

Holiday won a championship with Boston with a big assist from Portland’s front office. The Trail Blazers acquired Holiday from the Bucks two years ago in the Damian Lillard trade before general manager Joe Cronin flipped him to the Celtics. Holiday was grateful that the Blazers made that move and he’s willing to do whatever the organization asks of him.

“I really appreciate what they did for me the first time around. That really does mean a lot for me and my career,” he said.

Where Holiday fits in beyond this season remains to be seen. Lillard re-signed with the Blazers on a three-year deal after being waived by Milwaukee. He’ll spend the upcoming season rehabbing an Achilles tendon tear. Holiday said on Tuesday that he’d actually relish the opportunity to play with Lillard next season if he gets the chance.

Lillard: Returning To Blazers Was Both Family, Basketball Decision

July 22nd, 2025 at 3:03pm CST by Luke Adams

After spending the past two seasons with the Bucks, Damian Lillard – who signed a three-year contract over the weekend to return to the Trail Blazers – is thrilled about getting the opportunity to go “back home” and spend more time with his family in Portland, he said at a press conference on Monday.

“We got back in the car (after signing the contract),” Lillard said, per Lindsay Schnell of The Athletic. “I got to a red light, and my daughter goes, ‘Wait, we don’t have to get on the airplane to Milwaukee no more? You’re gonna be in your house? In Portland? The whole time?'”

In addition to Lillard’s three children, his mother and siblings are all in the Portland area, he noted on Monday, according to Anne M. Peterson of The Associated Press.

Still, even though those family considerations played a major role in his decision, rejoining the team with whom he spent the first 11 years of his NBA career wasn’t just about off-court factors, Lillard told reporters, including Sean Highkin of Rose Garden Report (Substack link).

“When we all sat down and this idea started to move towards me signing back here, I’m going to look at the basketball situation,” he said. “We play basketball and you want to win basketball games. A lot of people may look at it as a family decision, and obviously anybody would have their family be a part of a decision that they make. But this was just as much a basketball decision.

“… I’ve watched the team, even at a distance, and I’ve followed and stayed in touch with what was going on. Looking at how the league is trending and how it’s changing, it’s not the same old thing no more. Young teams that guard and have depth and compete and are connected, this team has all of those things. It’s all there, from the talent to the depth to having it on both sides of the ball, it’s all there.”

Although the Blazers missed the playoffs for a fourth straight year in 2025, their 36 wins were the most they’ve compiled in a season since 2020/21, and many of those victories came in the second half — the club went 23-18 following a 13-28 start. Lillard took notice of that improvement from a distance and suggested on Monday that he views the Blazers as “one of those teams that’s coming.”

While he’ll likely spent the entire 2025/26 season recovering from an Achilles tear he suffered in April, the 35-year-old expressed optimism about eventually returning to form. In the meantime, he’s looking forward to getting a chance to mentor the club’s younger players.

“One thing that I’ve missed over the last two years playing on an older team is, I’m able to be more and give more when I have something to pour into,” Lillard said. “When I’m invested in others’ careers more. Having the opportunity to do that, especially having a young, rising point guard like Scoot (Henderson) that I’m gonna be playing with now, and Toumani (Camara) and Deni (Avdija) and Shaedon (Sharpe), who I was with his rookie year.

“Being around those guys and having so much to share and being able to pour into them and be a part of their continued progress is something that elevates me as a player and as a teammate and as a leader. I’m looking forward to that as well, even when I’m playing.”

The Trail Blazers used their full $14,104,000 mid-level exception to sign Lillard, Hoops Rumors has confirmed. His salary will dip slightly to $13,398,800 in year two, followed by a third-year player option worth $14,104,000.

Northwest Notes: Beringer, Henderson, Hansen, Bates

July 13th, 2025 at 7:01pm CST by Eli Cohen

The workout that sealed Joan Beringer‘s selection by the Timberwolves with the 17th overall pick last month took place in Chicago less than a week before the draft, writes Jon Krawczynski of The Athletic.

The Wolves’ front office had been keeping an eye on the young big man, who only started playing basketball at 14 when he grew too big for soccer cleats throughout his season with Cedevita Olimpija. But that late workout allowed Beringer to show his skill set outside of the game tape, and that proved to be the deciding factor for Minnesota’s top decision-makers.

“I remember just catching an eye with [Wolves’ president Tim Connelly] and both of our eyebrows were kind of cocked, like what’s going on here, man,” said director of scouting Joe Connelly.

Beringer’s agent, Jelani Floyd, considered his client’s floor to be No. 16 with Orlando, but when the Magic traded their pick to the Grizzlies, the Wolves contacted him to schedule a last-minute workout — Floyd made the front office come to him.

“My whole thing is like, hey, come in, bring your staff, and we’ll be able to see how serious they were,” Floyd said.

The Wolves found the combination of Beringer’s size, mobility, and balance — which culminated in him performing a free-throw line dunk on command — impressive enough that they decided the French center had to be their guy.

We have more from around the Northwest division:

Trail Blazers‘ head coach Chauncey Billups is extremely encouraged by the offseason work from Scoot Henderson, who Billups said is having an incredible summer. “He had a tough year last year, only because he didn’t get to play basketball during the summer. He was banged up, he was licking his wounds from the season.” Billups said in a Summer League interview with the ESPN broadcast team (video link). “This year he’s been playing ball all summer, he’s been working on his game, as you said. Scoot is gonna take an incredible leap this year.” Billups also expressed excitement about how Jrue Holiday could help Henderson’s development: “What better guy in the league could you have to raise Scoot and Shaedon [Sharpe]?“
Yang Hansen was maybe the biggest surprise of the 2025 draft when the Trail Blazers picked him 16th overall, but his Summer League debut went a long way to quieting any doubters, writes Sean Highkin of Rose Garden Report (subscriber link). Hansen put up 10 points, four rebounds, five assists, and three blocks, and while his passing captured a lot of attention, Highkin says that it was his communication with his teammates that was the most impressive part of his debut performance. At least one person within the Blazers organization wasn’t surprised. “You don’t do something that crazy unless you’re sure about it,” said the anonymous staffer.
Tamar Bates is finding a way to impact the Nuggets‘ Summer League team outside of the box score, writes Bennett Durando of the Denver Post. Bates, who is on a two-way contract, has made an effort to be a vocal leader and communicator out on the floor. “I felt like I made a lot of winning plays,” Bates said. “I made a few shots, but I think the thing I’m most proud of is that I didn’t let a missed shot or a turnover affect my communication (and) my intensity.” Nuggets’ Summer League coach Andrew Munson agreed with the self-assessment. “He’s the loudest guy on the team, in all the right ways,” Munson said.

Reaction To Jrue Holiday-Anfernee Simons Trade

June 24th, 2025 at 8:08pm CST by Dana Gauruder

The Celtics pulled off a tremendous swap by not only getting off of Jrue Holiday‘s contract but also getting draft capital in return, John Hollinger of The Athletic opines.

Holiday has three years and $104.4MM left on his deal and it was fair to wonder whether the Celtics would have to attach a first-round pick or two to deal him, Hollinger writes. Instead, they’ll receive Anfernee Simons and two second-rounders from the Trail Blazers.

Boston could extend Simons’ deal — he’s got one year left on his contract, Hollinger notes. It’s also quite possible Simons could be flipped for a player with a lower cap hit as Boston looks to continue shedding salary. The Celtics reached an agreement on another cost-cutting deal on Tuesday, dealing Kristaps Porzingis to the Hawks in a three-team deal that will drop them under the second tax apron.

On the flip side, Hollinger believes this is a baffling move for Portland. The Blazers could have spent another year acquiring young talent and developing players. Instead, they’re trading one of their key sources of offense and handing the point guard duties to Scoot Henderson, who has struggled through his first two seasons.

Aaron Fentress of The Oregonian believes top executive Joe Cronin and coach Chauncy Billups are now in a must-win situation with an ownership change looming (Twitter link). The acquisition of Holiday could help the team reach the postseason and his long-term contract is irrelevant to the current regime, Fentress suggests, since Cronin and Billups might not survive an ownership change if the franchise endures another losing campaign.

The Trail Blazers don’t view themselves as a rebuilding team anymore, according to Sean Highkin of The Rose Garden Report (Substack link), who notes that making the postseason was a stated goal when Cronin and Billups received contract extensions after the team won 23 of its last 41 games.

According to Highkin, Holiday is the type of player that Billups has pined for since Damian Lillard was dealt. Holiday is not only a tough, defensive-minded guard but will provide much needed leadership in the locker room.

Highkin also points out that Cronin effectively picked Henderson over Lillard two years ago by drafting him with the No. 3 overall pick and is now choosing Henderson over Simons. Additionally, Highkin believes Holiday will be more willing to come off the bench behind Henderson than Simons would have been during his walk year, though Fentress (Twitter link) expects Holiday to end up in the starting lineup.

Finally, it’s worth noting that Steve Bulpett of Heavy.com has a source who claims Holiday is upset about being sent to Portland.

“If he winds up staying there, I’m sure he’ll be the professional he’s always been and make a positive contribution,” that source told Bulpett. “But he’s not happy with this deal. I’ll be surprised if Portland doesn’t move him on if they can, because right now he does not want to go there. I’m sure if he has to go to Portland, he’ll end up going and it’ll be OK, but right now they want to be somewhere else. But with that contract, it’s not going to be that easy.”

The idea that the Blazers would give up multiple draft picks to acquire Holiday only to try to trade him to another team doesn’t really pass the smell test, nor does it align with the reporting in the past 24 hours. We’ll see if any other reports corroborate the claim that Holiday is unhappy about the deal, but for now, the comments from Bulpett’s source can probably be taken with a grain of salt.

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