Stephon Marbury

And-Ones: Age Limit, Marbury, Boone

Lou Williams, who came into the league out of high school, isn’t a fan of the NBA’s one-and-done rule, Baxter Holmes of relays. “It’s a dumb rule,” Williams said. He added that he wants everyone to be in control of their own path.

“Personally, I understand the NBA and government and all of these things are extremely different,” Williams said. “You can go to war at 18, so you should be able to make a living at 18, especially if college isn’t what you see for yourself. You’re not realistically going there to be a “student-athlete” and wake up at six in the morning and lift weights and then have your day full with study hall and all these things. If you’re really not committed to that process and you’re only there for basketball, then I think that hurts the university as well.”

Here’s more from around the league:

  • The NBA age limit isn’t changing anytime soon, Tom Ziller of SB Nation argues. Ziller doesn’t believe the proposed zero-or-two rule would require the league to devote more time scouting the high school ranks, something it aimed to move away from when it established the age minimum. The scribe also believes that the D-League is ready to become a serious alternative to playing in the NCAA.
  • Stephon Marbury said his time with the Knicks was the “toughest” stretch of his career, as Ian Begley of passes along. “So much turmoil was going on,” Marbury said. Marbury clashed with teammates and coaches during his five years with the team. He agreed to a buyout with New York back in 2009.
  • Melbourne United, a team in Australia’s National Basketball League, has signed Josh Boone, Olgun Uluc of Fox Sports reports. Boone last played in the NBA for the Nets during the 2009/10 season.

Atlantic Notes: Larkin, Celtics, Blake

Shane Larkin, who recently inked a two-year, $3MM deal with the Nets, believes his career was stalled by the Knicks‘ triangle offense during the 2014/15 season, Stefan Bondy of The New York Daily News writes. “[The triangle] just wasn’t the best fit for me,” Larkin said. “It’s a good system but I’m a pick-and-roll point guard. That’s how I got in the NBA, playing pick-and-roll in college. That’s how I got here and now being back in a system where I can play the pick-and-roll and just getting in the lane, create for others, shoot my floater, and do a bunch of other things.

Here’s more from the Atlantic Division:

  • The Nets still haven’t made a decision regarding whether the team will attempt to negotiate a buyout with point guard Steve Blake or keep him on the roster, Bondy adds. “I know we have a lot of guys at the point guard position. That’ll be resolved hopefully in the next month, eliminate, so hopefully we won’t have as many going to camp,” GM Billy King said.
  • The Knicks signed Derrick Williams for less than initially thought, as he’ll get $8.8MM over two years, Eric Pincus of Basketball Insiders tweets.
  • Thaddeus Young has a 15% trade kicker in his deal with the Nets, Pincus relays (on Twitter).
  • DeMarre Carroll‘s four-year deal with the Raptors comes to $58MM total, notes Pincus (Twitter link).
  • The Celtics have officially renounced their rights to Shaquille O’Neal, Stephon Marbury, Michael Olowokandi, Michael Finley, Carlos Arroyo, Nenad Krstic, P.J. Brown, and Scot Pollard, which in turn removes their cap holds, Pincus notes (Twitter links). These moves drop Boston below the salary cap line for the first time in nearly 20 years, Chris Forsberg of writes. Boston also loses any form of Bird Rights to these players, though that is a mere formality since it is highly unlikely any of them would be suiting up for the team in the future.

Chuck Myron contributed to this post.

Trade Retrospective: Stephon Marbury To Knicks

With the Kevin Love trade saga now finally over, fans of all the teams involved are left to wonder whether or not their franchise got the better end of the deal. The Wolves dealt away their franchise player for a number of intriguing pieces, and the Cavs nabbed another star to pair alongside LeBron James and Kyrie Irving, while the Sixers chances to nab the No. 1 overall pick have improved markedly. It’s always a risky undertaking when dealing a top-tier player away, as many past trades have demonstrated. It’s with that in mind that I’ve been looking back at other blockbuster trades and how they have worked out for all involved.

So far I’ve examined the trades that sent Dwight Howard to the Lakers; Deron Williams to the Nets; Kevin Garnett to the Celtics; Carmelo Anthony to the Knicks; Chris Paul traded from the Pelicans to the Clippers; and the trade that sent Shaquille O’Neal from the Lakers to the Heat. Next up is a look at a trade that occurred on January 5th, 2004–the deal that sent Stephon Marbury from the Suns to the Knicks.

I’ll begin by running down the assets involved:

This trade had all the makings of a great story–a hometown star returns to change the fortunes of the Knicks franchise. Marbury was born and raised in Brooklyn, New York, and was a lifelong team fan. The Knicks were firmly mired in mediocrity, and this trade was intended to be a major step towards reversing the franchise’s fortunes.

Here are the Knicks’ records prior to trade:

  1. 2000/01: 48-34 (Lost in first round to Raptors)
  2. 2001/02: 30-52
  3. 2002/03: 37-45

The Knicks used this trade to acquire the star point guard they desperately needed, plus it also helped correct the less-than-stellar results of the franchise’s big move from the year before. I’m referring to the ill-fated deal that sent the draft rights to Nene; Marcus Camby; and Mark Jackson to Denver for Antonio McDyess and Frank Williams. McDyess was intended to be an anchor for the franchise, but instead he just added to his injury history, and only played in a total of 18 games in New York. Nene and Camby were much more productive over the years, and this trade ended up being one of the more imbalanced ones that you’ll see.

When New York made the Marbury deal, which was the first major move made during the Isiah Thomas regime, the Knicks hoped this would lead to a change in culture and a reversal of fortune. Things didn’t quite work out that way. Here are the Knicks’ records during the Marbury years:

  1. 2003/04: 39-43 (Lost in first round to Nets)
  2. 2004/05: 33-49
  3. 2005/06: 23-59
  4. 2006/07: 33-49
  5. 2007/08: 23-59

Not all the blame can rest on Marbury’s shoulders for the franchise’s lack of success. The Knicks didn’t have much talent around him, and a number of personnel moves ended up backfiring spectacularly during this era. But Marbury didn’t exactly perform up to the levels he did in Minnesota and New Jersey, either. Here are Marbury’s numbers during his time in New York:

  1. 2003/04: 19.8 PPG, 3.1 RPG, and 9.3 APG. His slash line was .431/.321/.833.
  2. 2004/05: 21.7 PPG, 3.0 RPG, and 8.1 APG. His slash line was .462/.354/.834.
  3. 2005/06: 16.3 PPG, 2.9 RPG, and 6.4 APG. His slash line was .451/.317/.755.
  4. 2006/07: 16.4 PPG, 2.9 RPD, and 5.4 APG. His slash line was .415/.357/.769.
  5. 2007/08: 13.9 PPG, 2.5 RPG, and 4.7 APG. His slash line was .419/.378/.716.

His first two years with the Knicks were excellent statistically, but he tailed off significantly starting with the 2005/06 campaign. Marbury’s lack of productivity led to him spatting publicly with then-coach Larry Brown.

Brown claimed that Marbury refused to take responsibility for his part in the team’s disastrous 2005/06 season. Marbury responded by saying, “I think it’s personal now. I don’t think it’s about basketball anymore. Now it’s to the point where he’s [Brown] putting his 30-year career against my 10-year career. You know, coach is a great coach is what everyone says. We’re supposed to be better than what we are. Did it happen now? No.”

Brown responded by saying, “So, you’re the best guard in the league and the team is 17-45, yeah, it’s the coach’s fault. I don’t know why you play a team sport and not be concerned about making your teammates better and helping your team win games. That’s the only thing that really matters, and if you’re the best player, surely you’re going to have some effect on the game’s outcome.”

That was Brown’s only campaign on the New York bench, and he was replaced the following season by Thomas, who also ended up clashing with Marbury, whose popularity was on the decline with the Knicks’ fan base thanks to all the issues and losing seasons. This player-coach feud culminated with rumors that Marbury and Thomas had allegedly gotten into a physical altercation at practice. Marbury further angered the organization and fans when he elected to have season-ending ankle surgery in February of 2008, which the team had deemed unnecessary at the time.

The Knicks explored potential trades for Marbury, but there wasn’t much interest in the then-31-year-old guard, who still had two years, and nearly $42MM remaining on his contract. Mike D’Antoni took over as head coach in 2008, and New York signed Chris Duhon as a free agent, and Duhon in turn won the starting point guard job during training camp. Marbury was placed on team’s inactive list. He and the team debated over his role and playing time, and when they were unable to come to an accord on a potential buyout, Marbury was banned from attending any practices or games.

The Knicks and Marbury finally reached a buyout arrangement in February of 2009, and after clearing waivers, he signed with the Celtics. Marbury finished out the season with Boston, averaging 3.8 PPG and 3.3 APG. The Celtics offered him a contract for the veteran’s minimum of for the 2009/10 season, which Marbury declined. He has been out of the league ever since.

Penny Hardaway was a shell of the superstar player he was during his years with the Magic. Injuries had taken their toll on his production and ability to remain on the court. Hardaway hadn’t lived up to the seven-year, $86MM contract he had inked in 1999 as part of the sign-and-trade deal that sent him from Orlando to Phoenix.

Hardaway was productive for the remainder of the 2003/04 season, and he played well in the Knicks’ first round playoff series loss to the Nets, averaging 16.5 PPG, 5.8 APG, 4.5 RPG, and 1.5 steals. After that he would only appear in 41 contests over the next two seasons due to injuries. Hardaway’s numbers with the Knicks were:

  1. 2003/04: 9.6 PPG, 4.5 RPG, and 1.9 APG. His slash line was .390/.364/.775.
  2. 2004/05: 7.3 PPG, 2.4 RPG, and 2.0 APG. His slash line was .423/.300/.739.
  3. 2005/06: 2.5 PPG, 2.5 RPG, and 2.0 APG. His slash line was .286/.000/1.000.

His time in New York ended in February of 2006 when he was traded back to Orlando, along with Trevor Ariza, for Steve Francis. Hardaway was then waived by the Magic in a cost-cutting move.

Cezary Trybanski only appeared in three games for the Knicks, averaging 0.3 PPG. He was then traded to the Bulls along with Othella Harrington; Dikembe Mutombo; and Frank Williams, for Jamal Crawford and Jerome Williams. Trybanski was waved by Chicago prior to the start of the season and he has been out of the league ever since.

The Suns made this deal to free up cap space for the summer of 2004, when they hoped to make a splash in free agency and build around their core of Amar’e Stoudemire, Joe Johnson, and Shawn Marion.

The Suns records prior to the trade were:

  1. 2000/01: 51-31 (Lost in first round to the Kings)
  2. 2001/02: 36-46
  3. 2002/03: 44-38 (Lost in first round to Spurs)

This deal is an odd one in that the Suns gave up the best player, didn’t receive much long term value in return, essentially squandered the draft picks they acquired, yet still came out ahead in the end. This is all thanks to the free agent signing of Steve Nash in July of 2004. All Nash did was win the MVP award in his first season and lead the Suns to the Western Conference Finals.

The Suns’ records post trade:

  1. 2003/04: 29-53
  2. 2004/05: 62-20 (Lost conference finals to Spurs)
  3. 2005/06: 54-28 (Lost conference finals to Mavs)
  4. 2006/07: 61-21 (Lost in second round to Spurs)
  5. 2007/08: 55-27 (Lost in first round to Spurs)

Howard Eisley finished out the rest of the 2003/04 season with Phoenix, averaging 7.1 PPG and 3.4 APG, then reached a buyout arrangement with the Suns for the remaining two years of his deal. Eisley then signed a one-year, $1.1MM contract with the Jazz that summer.

Charlie Ward was waived the day after the trade by Phoenix and was picked up shortly after by the Spurs for the rest of the 2003/04 season, when he averaged 3.3 PPG and 1.3 APG. Ward appeared in 14 games for the Rockets during the 2004/05 campaign, and then retired after the year.

Milos Vujanic was originally selected by the Knicks with the No. 36 overall pick in the 2002 NBA Draft. He never appeared in an NBA game, and played eight seasons in the Euroleague and Italian League before retiring in 2009.

Maciej Lampe was another second-round selection by the Knicks, taken with the No. 30 overall pick back in 2003, but he never appeared in a game while with New York. After the trade Lampe averaged 4.6 PPG and 2.1 RPG for the Suns. Lampe’s time in the desert came to an end in January of 2005, when he was traded along with Casey Jacobsen and Jackson Vroman to the Pelicans for Jim Jackson and a 2005 second-rounder (Marcin Gortat).

Antonio McDyess finished out the 2003/04 season with the Suns, averaging 5.8 PPG and 5.8 RPG. After the season he became a restricted free agent and signed with the Pistons, where he stayed for five seasons, and he became a valuable contributor off of the bench.

Both first round draft picks that the Suns acquired in the Marbury trade were later packaged along with Tom Gugliotta and a 2005 second-rounder (Alex Acker) and sent to Utah for Keon Clark and Ben Handlogten. This ended up being a terrible trade for Phoenix, as neither Clark or Handlogten appeared in an NBA game after being acquired by the Suns.

Utah used the 2004 first-rounder to select Kirk Snyder with the No. 16 pick. Snyder was a bust and was traded after one season to the Pelicans. His career numbers in four NBA seasons were 6.3 PPG, 2.3 RPG, and 1.1 APG. Some notable players that Utah could have had with that selection instead of Snyder were Josh Smith, J.R. Smith, Jameer Nelson, Kevin Martin, Anderson Varejao, and Trevor Ariza.

It’s the other draft pick from the Marbury trade that is more haunting to both Knicks and Suns fans. With the No. 9 pick in the 2010 NBA Draft, the Jazz selected Gordon Hayward. Let’s look at Hayward’s numbers since entering the league:

  1. 2010/11: 5.4 PPG, 1.9 RPG, and 1.1 APG. His slash line was .485/.473/.711.
  2. 2011/12: 11.8 PPG, 3.5 RPG, and 3.1 APG. His slash line was .456/.346/.832.
  3. 2012/13: 14.1 PPG, 3.1 RPG, and 3.0 APG. His slash line was .435/.415/.827.
  4. 2013/14: 16.2 PPG, 5.1 RPG, and 5.2 APG. His slash line was .413/.304/.816.

Hayward signed a four-year, $62,965,420 offer sheet with the Hornets this summer, which the Jazz quickly matched in order to keep Hayward in Utah for the foreseeable future.

Like I mentioned earlier, this is an odd trade in how it worked out. This became another failed deal during the Isiah Thomas years for the Knicks. The franchise could have benefited long term from retaining those two first-rounders, and saved themselves a number of headaches and public relations hits that resulted from Marbury’s presence on the team.

The Suns came out OK here, despite not receiving any long term assets besides salary cap room. Their signing of Nash away from the Mavs was a turning point in the franchise’s fortunes, and it wouldn’t have been possible if Phoenix hadn’t dealt away Marbury’s and Hardaway’s contracts. But it’s still hard to give them too much credit, seeing as they later gave up the two valuable first rounders they had acquired to Utah for essentially no return.

The Suns win this by default, but it’s interesting to imagine what might have happened had they held on to those picks and nabbed Josh Smith and Hayward instead. That would have truly been a landslide victory for them in regards to this deal, rather than winning it by default. The Marbury trade is a prime example of the risks involved for all franchises when making blockbuster deals. Knicks fans are still feeling the pain from all the misfires during 2000s, which included this one.

Atlantic Rumors: Zarren, Udrih, Woodson

The Atlantic Division is dreadful this year, and while that may be a matter of happenstance, it could lead to an unbalanced playoff bracket, as SB Nation’s Tom Ziller examines. The Atlantic-leading Raptors have a record that’s worse than the Pistons, but Toronto would draw the Bobcats in the first round while Detroit would have to face the Heat if the postseason began today. Of course, there’s plenty of season left, so while we wait to see if such disorder comes to fruition, here’s the latest from the NBA’s worst division:

  • The “wheel” proposal for assigning NBA draft picks is the brainchild of Celtics assistant GM Mike Zarren, as Steve Bulpett of the Boston Herald points out. GM Danny Ainge supports the idea as well, though Hoops Rumors readers aren’t quite as receptive.
  • Beno Udrih has been the subject of public criticism from Mike Woodson of late, and while the point guard isn’t calling his coach out by name, Ian Begley of thinks it’s clear that Udrih is frustrated with Woodson. “I’ve always been pretty good with not turning over the ball and this year it’s totally different. I don’t know what happened [last] summer. I don’t think I forgot [how] to play basketball. So there’s a lot of factors,” Udrih said. “You can point fingers at me as much as you can but if things don’t work it’s not one person’s fault … It’s a team sport.”
  • Former Nets, Knicks and Celtics guard Stephon Marbury recently signed a long-term deal to remain in China with the Beijing Ducks, and tells Marc Berman of the New York Post that there’s no chance he’ll play in the NBA again. The 36-year-old Marbury, who hasn’t appeared in the Association since the 2008/09 season, made similar comments about his future this past June.
  • We passed along news on the Knicksinterest in Rajon Rondo earlier this morning.

Stephon Marbury Extends Contract In China?

Stephon Marbury hasn’t appeared in an NBA game since 2009, having joined multiple Chinese teams since then, and it seems as if he won’t be returning to play stateside anytime soon. According to a report translated by Emiliano Carchia of Sportando, Marbury has reached a deal on a contract extension with the Beijing Ducks that will keep him under contract through 2017.

Marbury, once a perennial 20+ PPG scorer in the NBA, continues to play at an elite level in the CBA, having averaged 28.3 PPG to go along with 5.8 APG last season. The 36-year-old guard led the Ducks to their first ever championship in 2012, toppling the powerhouse Guangdong Southern Tigers, who have won eight of the last 10 CBA titles, including in 2013.

Be sure to check out our international player movement tracker to keep tabs on the contract status of thousands of players in non-NBA leagues all over the world.

Odds & Ends: Marbury, Shaw, J.R. Smith, Calathes

Stephon Marbury hasn't played in the NBA since the 2008/09 season, and he's not interested in making a comeback, telling reporters Tuesday in China that he prefers to continue playing in the Chinese league. Jonas Terrado of Tempo has the details. With the draft now just hours away, there's plenty of news on guys who are and will be a part of the NBA, and here's the latest:

  • New Nuggets coach Brian Shaw has a three-year deal with an option for a fourth, and his annual salary will be around $2MM, reports Benjamin Hochman of the Denver Post. It's not clear whether the option belongs to the Nuggets or to Shaw, though usually options in coaching contracts belong to the team.
  • The top priority for the Knicks this summer is retaining J.R. Smith, a source tells Ian Begley of, who passes along the note in an updated version of his story on the team's decision to extend a qualifying offer to Pablo Prigioni.
  • The Mavs own the rights to former second-round pick Nick Calathes, and there's mutual interest in bringing him to the NBA next season, reports Tim McMahon of Other NBA teams are interested, too, and the Mavs are willing to trade him if they can't fit him on their roster, McMahon writes. 
  • While noting that Luol Deng's camp is dismissing the idea that there's an extension in the works with the Bulls, as we heard yesterdayJoe Cowley of the Chicago Sun-Times writes that the Bulls are calling around to see what they can get for Richard Hamilton
  • Pacers assistant Jim Boylen has an agreement in place with the Spurs to join Gregg Popovich's coaching staff in San Antonio, tweets Adrian Wojnarowski of Yahoo! Sports. Boylen is not to be confused with former Bucks coach Jim Boylan, whom the Cavs hired as an assistant coach earlier today.
  • Sixers insiders expect minority owner Dave Heller to take over Adam Aron's role as liaison between the team's basketball operations and principal owner Josh Harris, writes Bob Ford of the Philadelphia Inquirer

Odds & Ends: Lakers, Jazz, Marbury, Draft, Frank

SBNation's Tom Ziller looks at Basketball-Reference statistics to examine players who've significantly outperformed their contracts this season. Not surprisingly, Chandler Parsons, in the middle of a four-year, $3.63MM contract that runs through 2015, rates highly. Many of the other players Ziller mentions are either minimum-salary signees or former first-round picks still on their rookie-scale deals. There's more on a few players who could be the next to sign rookie contracts and other news from around the Association, as we share here:

Atlantic Links: Celts, Sixers, Moultrie, Smith

As if the Atlantic division didn't have a busy enough offseason, the Celtics were active again on Thursday .  After waiving Keyon Dooling, who then retired, Boston signed Micah Downs to what is likely a non-guaranteed deal and gave guaranteed dollars to Darko Milicic.  They now have 14 guaranteed roster spots and 19 total players in training camp.  John Hollinger of ESPN gives his take, insider only, on the Celtics roster.

Surely, that couldn't have been it for the ever-changing Atlantic.  Let's keep track of all the other links floating around on Thursday within the division:

  • We have detailed at great length the roster overhaul that the Sixers went through this offseason.  John Hollinger of ESPN breaks down their new roster for the 2012-13 seasons (Insider access only).  
  • Dei Lynam of CSN Philly looks at Andrew Bynum and Andre Iguodala, both of whom could be unrestricted free agents this offseason.  Bynum seems like a good bet to re-sign in Philly, while the future of Iguodala, should he opt out, is far more difficult to predict.
  • The ankle injury that has hobbled Sixers first round pick Arnett Moultrie for most of the summer has not progressed as well as the team has hoped, reports John Mitchell of the Philadelphia Inquirer.  Moultrie's effectiveness is heavily reliant on his athleticism, making it crucial for him legs to be at full strength as a rookie.
  • Jonathan Abrams examines the enigma that is Knicks shooting guard J.R. Smith for Grantland.  Smith is ultra-talented and has been productive, but for whatever reason has not been able to find a home.  
  • Former Knick Stephon Marbury talked all things Knickerbockers with Ian Begley of ESPN New York.  Marbury questions Amare Stoudemire's ability to thrive without Steve Nash, the ownership's motives in bringing in Carmelo Anthony and the potential of the team to advance in the playoffs.

International Rumors: Marbury, Freeland, Koponen

A number of this morning's items of note relate to overseas players, so let's round them up in one place:

  • Stephon Marbury has high praise for the Chinese Basketball Association and doesn't intend to return to the NBA even if there's interest, according to (Chinese link; translation via HoopsHype).
  • British forward Joel Freeland, who was picked by the Trail Blazers in the first round of the 2006 draft, would cost $1.5MM for Portland to buy out, according to Cesar Nanclares of (Spanish link; translation via HoopsHype). A number of international clubs are also interested in Freeland, though his buyout to play elsewhere would be even more expensive ($3.1MM).
  • Nets' 2011 second-rounder Bojan Bogdanovic confirmed to (Croatian link) that he met with GM Billy King, but says coming to the NBA isn't up to him, according to HoopsHype.
  • Earlier this week, Emiliano Carchia of Sportando passed along an interview between Petteri Koponen and Il Corriere di Bologna, in which the point guard said he expects to talk to the Mavericks this summer. The Mavs own the rights to the 30th pick in the 2007 draft, and the Dallas Morning News looks at the possibility of Koponen coming to Dallas for next season.

Marbury Not Interested In Joining Knicks

Former Knicks point guard Stephon Marbury has no interest in returning to the Knicks even if the team reaches out to him to help their beleaguered backcourt for the remainder of the season, reports Marc Berman of the New York Post. The New York Post contacted Marbury via email and asked him what he would do if the Knicks contacted him about a roster spot now that former head coach Mike D'Antoni is no longer with the team to which Marbury responded that he would do nothing.

The former Georgia Tech star led his team to the CBA championship on Friday night by scoring 42 points in the series-clinching game. While Marbury may be playing well and in great shape according to J.R. Smith, Knicks head coach Mike Woodson seems content moving forward with Baron Davis, Mike Bibby and Toney Douglas at the point. Davis will remain the starter with Bibby and Douglas competing for backup minutes as the season winds down.

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