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Knicks Will Not Take Boozer In Sign-And-Trade?

JULY 5th: While some have been skeptical that the Knicks would go for Boozer in a sign-and-trade, new team president Phil Jackson would have to consider it, and a person with knowledge of the situation said it’s expected that he would, writes Sam Amick of USA Today.

JULY 1st: The Bulls might want to work out a sign-and-trade deal with the Knicks for Carmelo Anthony, but they won’t be able to do it with Carlos Boozer, writes Chris Broussard of  Chicago would probably want to include Boozer, who has been mentioned as an amnesty candidate, in such a deal, but the Knicks aren’t interested in the veteran forward.

Of course, this is all somewhat premature since the Bulls have yet to reach out to New York about an S&T scenario.  Still, it stands to reason that the Knicks would want to get something in return for Melo if he skips town.

Boozer is set to earn $16.8MM this season and Bulls owner Jerry Reinsdorf is probably less than thrilled about the prospect of paying him for nothing.  However, if he’s willing to go through with the amnesty clause, Broussard lays out some possibilities for the Bulls if they get Anthony to agree to sign.  If the Bulls dump Boozer and trade away Mike Dunleavy for nothing, could start a four-year deal for Anthony at $15MM in the first year.  If they moved Jimmy Butler as well, they could start Melo off at $17MM.  Of course, that’s still less than the $22.4 million the Knicks can offer him next season.

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39 thoughts on “Knicks Will Not Take Boozer In Sign-And-Trade?

  1. Vegandork

    It’s funny to watch the Knicks make proclamations based on a false sense of power.

    They’ll take Boozer back if they intend to get picks in return. Or they can be giant babies and hold steady to not taking Boozer back and simply get nothing. Considering an expiring deal has value and so do picks, you’d think the Knicks would get over themselves enough not to try and make obviously false proclamations to the media. All a statement like this is going to do is make Carmelo mad. If there was any chance Melo was staying in New York, its about zero now.

    • Dynasty22

      The owner of the Bulls has been known to be stingy with his money. Do you think the Bulls owner is willing to pay Boozer 16.8 million dollars not to play for him? Quite frankly, the Knicks would rather let Melo sign outright with a team in the Western Conference than trade him and get assets from the Bulls. So yeah, based on those circumstances you should be prepared to give up more than just Boozer and picks for Carmelo Anthony.

      • Vegandork

        The Reinsdorf argument is a false argument based off lingering resentment for the Michael Jordan situation. The Bulls consistently have one of the highest payrolls, and made the second most money last year according to Forbes. If they ate Boozer’s deal and signed Anthony, they’d still make the second most money.

        The Bulls can make other trades to free up just over $16 million, which is not that far off. Anthony might require a max deal from some teams, but joining a team that’s an instant title contender is supposedly what he wants. Chicago is the only place he can get it.

        As for the “bad business man” argument…I’ll just laugh at that. You’d have to not understand the way the cap system works to think it’s a bad decision. If the Knicks have any chance of acquiring a high salary long term piece, they need big, expiring deals. Even after their last deal, they’d have no way of acquiring, say, a Kevin Love, without someone like Boozer to deal.

        • The Knicks have huge expiring deals already in the forms of Andrea Bargnani ($11 mill, I think) and Amare Stoudemire (about $20 mill). Plus, smaller expiring contracts in Dalembert, Ellington, Shumpert, Larkin Shannon Brown, Jeremy Tyler and Hardaway (Hardaway and Larkin have team options for about 1.5mill. Probably worth exercising both for young exciting players on an old defunct team) BTW, huge Knicks fan

          • Manchershaw Engineer

            Yeah but those expiring deals are worthless because no one’s going to trade you a good player for an expiring deal and no other assets. The Knicks have NO assets to add to a deal. That’s where Chicago would come in.

            The Knicks have three options. Trade for Boozer and use the assets and Boozer to swing another deal, trade for Boozer and keep the assets, or don’t trade for Boozer and continue to have no assets and a high payroll and a roster that no one will sign with next season despite the money cleared in a year.

          • Dynasty22

            So the expiring contracts are worthless yet you say the Knicks should take back Boozer’s expiring contract? And what assets are you referring to? You’re not going to get Melo for just Boozer and draft picks. New York is always an attraction and playing under a team managed by Phil Jackson probably makes it more attractive to free agents.

          • Manchershaw Engineer

            Draft picks are huge. The bulls have picks to offer and the rights to Mirotic. If all they have to do is absorb Boozer to get them, that’s a no brainer when you’re in such dire straights as the Knicks are.

            You don’t trade Boozer for Love. You use Boozer’s salary to match Love’s, and you throw draft picks from the Knicks, Bulls, and Mirotic’s rights and try to get Love (or whoever else you can).

            The biggest thing to understand though is that Boozer isn’t important as a trade piece in a future deal as he is simply the only way the Knicks can improve on their situation. Unless the Knicks take on Boozer, they’re looking at not competing until they win the lottery in a year where a marque player comes out. That’s a long time to wait.

          • Kay Alley

            Most Knick fans have resigned themselves to waiting for one year anyway, so that’s not a big deal.

          • Manchershaw Engineer

            Try a decade. No one is signing for the Knicks just because they have space. Especially if they let Melo walk without getting at least picks in return. They need to make the roster better for the future so they’re appealing to marquee free agents, and they can’t do that without lots of picks.

            edit: I think you misunderstood me. I didn’t mean to say next year the Knicks will win the lottery and a marque player will come out. I mean the Knicks will have to wait a very long time, because if they don’t start working on something now, they’ll have to wait until a year comes up where they both win the lottery and a marquee player is in the draft. Most drafts don’t have them, and as the Bucks and 76ers will tell you, winning the lottery isn’t an easy bet in any year, let alone the one draft a decade where the can’t miss talent is there.

          • Kay Alley

            Sounds like you wish/hope that the Knicks have to “wait a very long time”, but that’s not gonna happen. The combo of Phil Jackson and finally getting some of these bloated contracts off the books so that we can actually compete for players helps and somebody will come to NY in 2015. Doesn’t have to be a “marquee player” either, just a competent second option. Playing in NYC might make that person a “marquee player” though.

            And we don’t have to help Chicago improve it’s roster and playoff chances by making a trade for your overpaid player to do it. We’ve got enough overpaid players of our own to deal with, don’t need one more, you all figure out what to do with Boozer.

            And the Knicks aren’t comparable to the Bucks and Sixers by any stretch of your imagination. With practically the same roster we won 54 games the season before and got to the second round, we obviously had a bad year this year. Doesn’t make us a lottery team. But keep trying to sell dreams in order to improve the Bulls roster. Melo ain’t coming, you all better start working on Plan B – Lance Stephenson perhaps? Good luck with that.

          • Manchershaw Engineer

            Nothing like having no talent on the roster and then playing both sides of the coin. All the money’s off the books next year! Pieces of this team won 50 games one year sometime ago! Smacks of desperation.

            Look, you wanna believe that Phil Jackson is going to bring all of these marque players to New York, go ahead and believe it. The rest of us realize what Phil’s known for is working for the last generation of players and his inability to adjust to today’s NBA. He couldn’t coach today’s players anymore, and now they’re supposed to want to play for him? And on a clean slate roster? That also smacks of desperation.

          • Kay Alley

            Hey don’t worry about it! Melo has asked for Pau’s phone number to try and entice him to come to the Knicks. Granted his pleas may not work, but the fact that he is at least making an attempt (reported last night while CHI and others sit around waiting for his answer) tells me he will not be leaving the Knicks.

            You sure don’t give Phil Jackson much credit considering his coaching help to put CHI on the map. Ungrateful much? And as far as the “coaching today’s players” comment, you do realize he is not the Knicks coach, right? But hey don’t worry about what Phil can/cannot do for the Knicks – worry about getting more offense for CHI elsewhere. That’s all your team needs, right?

            And by the way, we don’t need a bunch of marquee players – we didn’t need that a year ago and got to round two. Had they played to their potential last year we would’ve competed and we were still a few games shy of making the playoffs. Knicks only need dedicated, consistent players. I think Phil can handle that. Getting rid of Felton and Chandler was a coup in and of itself.

            Finally, CHI is the ones that seem desperate, trying to pawn off their bad Boozer contract on to unsuspecting teams. Phil nipped that in the bud quick, fast, and in a hurry. You all are gonna have to find another sucker to trap into taking on Boozer, or use your amnesty on him.

            Your choice.

          • Manchershaw Engineer

            Pau Gasol is not going to the Knicks. In fact, the Knicks are not even on the teams Pau’s agent released as teams he’d sign with. The reason is there’s no roster. The Knicks aren’t on ANYONE’S list, and they won’t be in a year either. Good teams aren’t made overnight, and the Knicks are several years (if not a decade) away barring a big 3 reunion in New York (chances of that are not too good).

            Unlike some people, I am not blinded by sentiment. Jackson was terrible his last few years in LA. He lost those teams, and he lost them because today’s NBA players are different.

            I don’t know why you think the Bulls are desperate. They’re a championship contender without making any moves. And the don’t have to trade Boozer, nor are they desperate to trade him. They can simply amnesty Boozer and use the money to sign any number of coals in the fire (Carmelo is one of many options, as many players view Chicago as the place to be). Carmelo is the biggest fish, but Chicago doesn’t have to go the three superstar route to contend (as they have depth, flexibility, and players/coaches that free agents actually want to sign with).

          • Kay Alley

            You’re not paying attention. I don’t expect Pau to come to the Knicks, never wrote that. But the fact that Melo is recruiting for the Knicks tells me he’s coming back, and that’s a good thing for us.
            Talking about being blinded by sentiment – you won’t even admit that the Knicks perhaps just had a bad season considering the fact that they won 54 games, took the Atlantic Division title and got to the 2nd round just one year ago. You just label them losers based on one bad season. We’re pretty close to being contenders ourselves just missing a few pieces. And just because those players on the Lakers didn’t buy into Phil’s philosophy doesn’t mean this group won’t – and that it won’t work.
            And who is the last marquee free agent to sign with CHI? Only reason Knicks haven’t entertained any is because of bad financial decisions leaving us with no cap space, not because they don’t want to play in NY.

          • Manchershaw Engineer

            Carmelo isn’t recruiting Pau to the Knicks, he’s recruiting him in conjunction with other teams. Melo could wind up with Pau in Dallas, Los Angeles, and even Chicago. The thought that they’d wind up together is New York without any roster support is laughable. Even if Melo was sentimental enough, Pau’s not that stupid. He’s a big man in his 30’s, he needs to win now.

            The Knicks players have regressed due to age and injuries. Even if they didn’t outplay their potential a few years back, they’re not and will never again be that good with that roster.

          • alphakira

            They didn’t regress due to age – they actually got younger, they regressed due to terrible coaching. The best coaches they had were on the court in Kidd and Chandler. One left them physically and the other left them mentally. You don’t accidentally trip into the 2nd seed, even in the East.

          • Manchershaw Engineer

            Having younger, bad players on the roster didn’t help their core get younger. The Knicks are desperate to shed their core.

            The did trip into that 2nd seed. There was only one good team in the East that year. Chicago didn’t have Derrick Rose all season and Indiana had yet to develop. It was by default. Someone had to be the second seed.

        • Dynasty22

          The Knicks don’t need Boozer to get Love in 2015. If they kept all the players currently under contract for the 2015-2016 season and kept Melo for, say, 20 million a year, the Knicks would still have around 23 million to spend under the current cap limit. They can sign Kevin Love outright if they wanted.

          • Manchershaw Engineer

            Yes. In a magical world where Carmelo Anthony wants to resign with a team that’s only shot comes on the off chance someone signs onto his team in his age 32 season as well as every draft pick the next few seasons panning out, then yes.

            Carmelo is not resigning. He’s said all the right things, but there’s simply no reason to sign in New York. They can offer more than, say, the Bulls, but not significantly more than other options which give him a better, clearer path to a championship. There is zero chance he’s staying in New York. Which is why the Knicks’ comments are so completely and utterly ridiculous. Chicago offers the best chance for New York to get something back. By making these statements, it makes it more likely that Carmelo chooses another team and signs outright.

          • Dynasty22

            It is utterly ridiculous that the Knicks don’t want to make the Bulls better? Like I said, I would bet Phil Jackson would rather let Melo sign outright with team in the Western Conference(Lakers, Rockets, etc) than help trade Melo to the Bulls or any other team in East. Face it. The Knicks are in the driver’s seat when it comes to Melo going to Bulls.

          • Manchershaw Engineer

            The Knicks will be in the lottery every year until Phil Jackson is fired if he doesn’t trade with the Bulls. The Knicks are only in the drivers seat if the car is riding off a cliff.

    • Dynasty22

      Excuse my double post but I forgot to mention that the Bulls are already 6 million dollars over the cap so even amnestying Boozer gives them just 10.8 million. So unless you want to trade Taj Gibson to free up space or trade Dunlevy and 2 or 3 other players, you NEED the Knicks to sign and trade Melo.

    • alphakira

      ‘False sense of power’? The Knicks have ALL the power here. The only teams that Melo can sign a decent contract with that aren’t bottom feeders is Dallas and L.A. and Cuban already said he won’t offer anyone max money. And they don’t need to ‘get over themselves’ as they’re not teenage girls talking to each other in high school…Phil is trying to build a winning product, you don’t do that by taking in a player that was bench at the end of games last year because he has the complete inability to defend.

      You say they’ll get back nothing if they don’t take Boozer…Why would they want to pay 17 million for 2 or 3 draft picks that will be somewhere in the mid 20s? You’d be a terrible businessman.

  2. Michael Nguyen

    Knicks should only do it if they get back at least 2 1st rounders to build for the future.

  3. Hannibal8us

    All this work for a guy in Melo who probably doesn’t even make the Bulls favorites in the East and that’s IF Rose is still a superstar.

    • Manchershaw Engineer

      That’s not an opinion many in the industry would agree with.

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  5. alphakira

    Did anyone see what Phil pulled off with the Felton/Tyson trade?
    Phil doesn’t take anything less than Taj, Butler, and a pick or 2 along with Boozer or he simply says ‘nope’.

    • Manchershaw Engineer

      Then he simply loses Melo for nothing and watches the Knicks lose out in free agency the next several years until his inevitable dismissal. The only reason not to sign and trade for picks/Mirotic is to be stubborn. I doubt Jackson is that dumb. A pick is better than nothing. He has zero leverage, despite his false posturing.

      • Melo is not going down to $15 mill. Only way the Bulls get him is sign and trade (even with Amnestying Boozer, signing outright would be very difficult), and they will have to pay handsomely for Phil to cooperate. Knicks have the upper hand

        • Manchershaw Engineer

          Bulls can free up enough to pay him a bit more than that, but the big picture is there are teams like Houston and Dallas that can outright give him max and they have better rosters than the Knicks. It isn’t Chicago via sign and trade or bust. It’s Chicago via sign and trade with picks/Mirotic back, or Melo gone for absolutely nothing. New York has no leverage, Melo is going where he wants and it’s his terms, not Phils. He can do Phil a favor by picking Chicago, but he isn’t picking them for more than a few picks back.

  6. Resneps2340

    The Knicks shouldn’t dismiss such a trade right off the bat. Yes, Boozer is not worth $16.8 million if the only other thing you are including is picks. The Bulls aren’t trading Taj either since he was in the Carmelo meeting today and I’m sure him being on the team was part of the sales pitch.

    If the Knicks took Boozer, I think the Bulls would be willing to give up a couple of picks, the rights to Nikola Mirotic (one of the best young players in Europe who is likely to come over this year), and as much as I hate to say it, Jimmy Butler. I think the Bulls are beyond desperate to get Melo and frankly, the Knicks may not be able to do better that that in a S & T.

    • Do you think Mirotic would come over if he was traded? Big market in NY could appeal to him

      • Manchershaw Engineer

        Mirotic is coming no matter where he is traded. His European team was a mess this season and he wants nothing more to do with them.

        • I would love Mirotic in NY if Melo leaves. Ultimately, want to keep Melo though

    • Dynasty22

      Being a Knicks fan, I would take this package easily if that’s what it comes down to.

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